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  1. #1
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    A Sense of Fair Play

    I was thinking the other night about all the reasons men allow themselves to become slaves to women and many of them we discuss regularly such as hormonal and biological drives, and especially r.e. this post: indoctrination.

    We all know that indoctrination begins almost as soon as we are able to communicate with phrases such as boys shouldn’t hit girls, girls are nice (sugar and spice etc.) and boys are mean, and as we grow older it continues: men should protect and provide for women with no real explanation as to why – just do it because that’s what good men do.

    But after reflecting on the posts made by Opaque in a recent thread (you see – I do pay attention even if I disagree on some points) I began to think about the notion of fair play and how insidious it is.

    From childhood we are encouraged to share – share our sweeties and our toys and to play nice. Again this continues as we grow – be compassionate to the less well off, don’t judge others, give your time / money to charitable causes and don’t criticise their work or you’re a bad person.

    Even now I have a certain leaning towards this type of thinking in so far as we all have our bad times and can use a little help now and again, but my point is rarely are we warned of the downside; therefore IMO it is another manipulation.


    What downside?

    How many times have we “loaned” things to people never to see them again (sharing)? It doesn’t matter what it was: money, music, books, and especially tools; and if you do see them again they are often damaged or destroyed. Now not everyone is like this but experience tells me the majority of people both male and female are.

    And don’t criticise people who decide to live their lives on welfare, have some compassion for their plight! (I’ve been unemployed myself and probably will be again, that’s not what I’m talking about)

    And talking of compassion, what about those with drug problems or behavioural conditions that steal from you, attack you, or otherwise cause you problems; try to understand things from their viewpoint.

    No, no, a hundred times no!

    These people are parasites and cause us nothing but problems, why should we respond with anything but disdain?


    O.K., so what’s all this got to do with men pandering to women?

    Everything about our speech patterns reinforces the notion that when men interact with women with sex on our mind that we are obtaining something of value:

    How far did you get?
    Did you get anywhere with yer one last night?
    Did she give it up?
    I managed to get laid last night.

    Now combine this with the notion of fair play and reciprocity and it would seem to suggest that men “owe” women in some way, however subliminally for having enjoyed ourselves, even if she enjoyed it just as much or even more. Obviously this is total bullshit when you think about it rationally, but even thinking rationally can often have a hard time competing with this level of programming from the moment we are born – it often takes years to figure out.

    While this doesn’t by any means totally explain blue pilled man’s behaviour of showering females with gifts, bringing them out for expensive meals, or totally enslaving yourself by cohabitation / marriage in the hope of getting something, maybe it’s another piece in the puzzle.
    "Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

    All we can do is keep ourselves from all those who don't deserve it. – Dave Matthes

  2. #2
    Senior Member Opaque's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    We all know that indoctrination begins almost as soon as we are able to communicate with phrases such as boys shouldn’t hit girls, girls are nice (sugar and spice etc.) and boys are mean, and as we grow older it continues: men should protect and provide for women with no real explanation as to why – just do it because that’s what good men do.
    My theory has been consistent since day one when I joined this good forum. The manipulation beings with the female caretaker (usually the biological mother). She is rooting for team vagina. And even if you are falsely accused of rape, the mother would still be rooting (silently) for team vagina.

    This may not be the case for everyone. I am sure you can find one or two good mothers here and there. But I think in general mothers wilfully hide life advice about female manipulation to the detriment of men.

    This is why I always INSIST that any newbie should in his intro, write in detail about female manipulation. Otherwise, they should be considered suspect (barring specific unique instances).

    From childhood we are encouraged to share – share our sweeties and our toys and to play nice. Again this continues as we grow – be compassionate to the less well off, don’t judge others, give your time / money to charitable causes and don’t criticise their work or you’re a bad person.
    Men do not become aware of instrumentalising and weaponising information. They give it freely to anyone who needs it. We should be shrewd and charge for any effort on our part. This is a transactional, political world and we need to behave accordingly.

    If you do not share, you feel guilty. Women never feel guilty about benefitting themselves, even at the expense of others. Good for them, we need to do the same.

    Regarding welfare. Do not feel guilty for taking the maximum amount!! Cunts enjoy welfare like there is no tomorrow; and as a tax paying hard working man, I will tell you to enjoy it guilt free!

    Now combine this with the notion of fair play and reciprocity and it would seem to suggest that men “owe” women in some way, however subliminally for having enjoyed ourselves, even if she enjoyed it just as much or even more. Obviously this is total bullshit when you think about it rationally, but even thinking rationally can often have a hard time competing with this level of programming from the moment we are born – it often takes years to figure out.

    While this doesn’t by any means totally explain blue pilled man’s behaviour of showering females with gifts, bringing them out for expensive meals, or totally enslaving yourself by cohabitation / marriage in the hope of getting something, maybe it’s another piece in the puzzle.
    Men are doing beings, they produce, they create and they toil. Women are being beings, they enjoy that which is already created. Men objectify themselves and take pride in making themselves a tool. That is why male fashion is ''functional''. Trousers have many pockets, because a man needs to carry tools to fix things. A man can never enjoy a meal or a piece off clothing because he likes it and it serves no other purpose.

    Again this comes from early in childhood, many from the biological mother.

    In the western world like UK, US, Australia, this is compounded by a social manipulation which is SJWism and feminism (the man hating variety).

    It was easy to swallow the red pill for me, because the manipulation I had to get rid of was only from my mother. The manipulation that white man have to get rid of is both material + societal. And good luck with that because by the time you find out, you have already spent most of your life savings on expensive dinners and drinks for some cunt not only won't open her legs at the end of the date, but probably hates your guts as well.


    And don’t criticise people who decide to live their lives on welfare, have some compassion for their plight! (I’ve been unemployed myself and probably will be again, that’s not what I’m talking about)
    Be nice, be kind and be ''understanding''. If you have a bad experience, then forgive. It is healing right? I think this is bullshit. Men lose the ability to hold people accountable. The barista in Starbucks made an unsatisfactory coffee? You call HQ and make a complaint. Or better yet you complain on the spot and make the barista make the coffee 10 times until he gets it right. I do similar things on occasion.

    Women do this from the age of 3. And they never stop until old age. Again, good for them and we should learn from them.
    A mother cannot raise a boy to be a man, not because he needs a father figure; but because she favours team vagina over her own son.

    Tradcon women are the most manipulative of all kinds of women, because they infect you with false hope.
    Radfems are your best friend, because they hate you and verbalise it - that's honesty!

    The red pill rage is a process which takes many many years - so be kind and patient with yourself.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Joetech's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Jackoff brings up a good point that I was introduced to an at early age. Keep in mind that in 1959 when I started kindergarten women had already achieved the right to vote, and mommy dearest was a dyed in the wool Democrat. Get the picture? Now, add to that the stigma of growing up in the north with a displaced mother from South Carolina and a rebellious Italian father who gave up being Catholic (big sacrifice...sarc) for his Methodist wife, and drop the whole family into a Polish Catholic neighborhood and you have a picture of my childhood. I can still remember the nuns (we called them penguins...no disrespect intended) coming to visit my mom while my dad was at work. She was living in sin and needed to, no, not repent...convert. The in-laws sent them...or was it the neighbors? My mother used to get so mad. Fair play?

    Then, there was the German family that lived down the street from me. Their son was my age and their other son was my brother's age. We played with them all the time, but because my friend's father had served in the Wehrmact during the war the Poles in the neighborhood didn't want me playing with him. According to their sense of fair play, his father fought for the wrong side, so his kids should be punished. I never bought into it.

    When I was 12 I was thrown out of a movie theater because a girl started a fist fight with me and I defended myself. By high school I was watching girl's get pregnant, and watching guys get their futures cashed in for a job at the steel plant or one of the other mills in town. By the time I left home I knew women were dangerous, but I did it to myself anyway thinking 'love will conquer all'. Boy, was I wrong!

    I'm 65 now and according to certain women I do have behavioral problems...I act like a man. And now that I know what the problem is, I can honestly say that I'm not worried about it...they are.

    That's fine with me. A piece of the puzzle, you say? What puzzle? All I see when I look in the mirror is a man who acts like a man. They're the ones with the puzzle to figure out and when us pieces don't fit where they try to put us, boy, do they pitch a fit. And society in general rants and raves about people like us for the same reasons they used to call us hippies subversives. Yeah, and you thought deplorable was bad!

    We're indoctrinated from a very early age to "think like the mob".
    "Don't follow in my footsteps. I stepped in something."

  4. #4
    Senior Member rkspsm's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    I'd like to add some thoughts to this, got these recently from sources related to a philosophy (political movement really) I follow. The people who know me, will know which one, but that is not necessary for the point I want to make.

    The thing is, we all have a huge bias when it comes to crime and punishment. From "we" I mean everyone, man, woman, their dog, etc. And the bias is, we consider masculine crimes much more sinister than feminine crimes. From masculine crimes, I mean all crimes which relate to or involve or involve a threat of actual physical violence. From feminine crimes, I mean all crimes related with lying and manipulation.

    Just like women can and do commit masculine crimes, males just often commit feminine crimes. But the punishment is often less. Consider a dude sexually harassing a woman by grabbing her boobs or something against her will (but didnt otherwise hurt her much), he will get a lot harsher punishment than if he defrauded/conned her for few bucks (but no other damage). In both the cases, the perpetrator is a dude, so we are not really comparing the gender bias of society, but the bias on the nature of crimes. The second one is a feminine crime.

    If we dont deal with feminine crime as harshly as masculine crimes, women will always have an upper hand, not only they have physical/bodily features to seduce men, they have more developed psychological/mental capacity to work with feminine crimes, on an average atleast. There are corporal punishments for many masculine crimes, how many corporal punishments exist for feminine crimes ? I dont remember any, unless it results in or devolves into masculine crime (say a person died because of a fake drug). Feminine crimes are incentivized, not only the punishment is less, but often its not there because most crimes arent even considered a crime. You can just get away with it in broad daylight.

    This is why I support the idea of punishing the liars, and increasing punishment for repeat offenders or serious offenses (eg: politicians lying to public). And just like with masculine crimes, ignorance shouldnt be an excuse, just like its not an excuse with masculine crimes.
    "Truth is enough." - Curt Doolittle
    "Truth, and violence to enforce it." - Eli Harman

  5. #5
    Senior Member mgtower's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by rkspsm View Post

    If we dont deal with feminine crime as harshly as masculine crimes, women will always have an upper hand
    If men don't hold personal constitutions, they chip off pieces of their soul in the compromise, if enough men compromise, we have the situation we have today, and that's molested law, when the law governing the people recklessly endangers the people, like a destroyed family, orphaned bastard children, the sex carousel, STD's, and on and on, women being the "weaker" of our species have no alternative but to manipulate the government into supporting them in all the ways the government supports them, but not us.

    Females are masters of psychological warfare, they'll turn a calm peaceful unknowing and unwitty man, twist his mind with emotional terrorism, and turn him into a would be killer with the helping hands of female empowerment with iron clad protection from accountability in her emotional warfare with devastating legal consequences for any given man.

    Our only escape from this timeline to hell is full personal quarantine from the 21st. century woman as she's not accountable for her crimes against humanity. Just look at the long trail of destruction started so long ago, when women were handed power and authority by the men they manipulated, and all they ever wanted ever since is more more more and some more, never pondering for a moment what the changes they made have done, for men, children, family, culture, and the very fabric of life that's supposed to cradle us.

    The cradle of life (for men) has become an iron maiden.

    We live in the "aftermath" the calculations and tally was done the day each of us had decided we had had enough! My only answer? Walk away, it's already burned to the ground, there's nothing for us but ashes and hot embers.

    No force in heaven or on earth can move me from my path away from all the destruction and onto a path of self preservation and ignorance to tyrants and their tyranny. After all, tyranny is the unbridled liberty of one placed over the other.
    A man's only "safe space" be in his sovereignty, free from the illusions and misconceptions of a unity that only serves to bind him to tyranny and perdition.

  6. #6
    Senior Member rkspsm's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by mgtower View Post
    Our only escape from this timeline to hell is full personal quarantine from the 21st. century woman as she's not accountable for her crimes against humanity.
    I slightly disagree on this point. My disagreement comes from not that I think its incorrect, but incomplete rather. Our escape is full personal quarantine from ALL parasites. And that means including all parasitic MEN too. Anyone, man or woman, who engages in parasitic behavior, even mild ones, even those who are ignorant or dont know better, should not be exempt from this. Even as small as lying or spreading misinformation, willfully and knowingly or unknowingly, is parasitic behavior.

    Yes, those who are ignorant but reach the red pill enlightenment and change themselves, then thats fine, but until that happens, I am looking at that man belonging to the same group as any parasitic woman.
    "Truth is enough." - Curt Doolittle
    "Truth, and violence to enforce it." - Eli Harman

  7. #7
    Senior Member mgtower's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by rkspsm View Post
    I slightly disagree on this point. My disagreement comes from not that I think its incorrect, but incomplete rather. Our escape is full personal quarantine from ALL parasites. And that means including all parasitic MEN too. Anyone, man or woman, who engages in parasitic behavior, even mild ones, even those who are ignorant or dont know better, should not be exempt from this. Even as small as lying or spreading misinformation, willfully and knowingly or unknowingly, is parasitic behavior.

    Yes, those who are ignorant but reach the red pill enlightenment and change themselves, then thats fine, but until that happens, I am looking at that man belonging to the same group as any parasitic woman.
    Agreed, however, I found the honor of good men can't be repudiated, whereas women can't be entrusted to hold true to an eternal scale, they meander and drift as time passes becoming reprobates in the process, like someone stuck in the mud going reverse and forward only to dig themselves in deeper, the mud being the lack of tangible honor (solid moral ground). They don't have a good internal compass, there's too much magnetic deviation, they can't see the world the way we do nor hold true and steady to any given direction. Being empowered with advantages and privileges over and above us, they'll only jam our rudder so we're forced to do the same endless circles they do. The circles include cock carousel sex exchange, to the common practice dubbed "starter husband".

    We've been made into a disposable utility, a shit mop and ass-wipe rag all in one! There's no negotiating from that position, therefore, it's make no friends, take no prisoners, we've become a neutral country, we're off the battlefield, it's no longer a fight, it's a SLAUGHTER!

    All the powers of family rest in the institution of Family Court, not in men as it once did before we were deemed disposable. They grabbed the keys to the future so they can drive us over a cliff? Who in their right mind would want to be a passenger in their own car (bought and paid for) only to have a maniac handcuff you around the passenger doorpost then drive you over a cliff?

    My point is that men hold no legal advantage over you unless they're lawfully segregated by race and treated special the way women are by gender. (affirmative action)

    Misandry has become a long arm of the law! We pay a price based on our gender, that's what equality has achieved for all intents and purposes. I'm a 3rd class citizen according to the guidelines of affirmative action, my seat isn't in the back of the bus, my place is behind the bus, pushing the bus!
    A man's only "safe space" be in his sovereignty, free from the illusions and misconceptions of a unity that only serves to bind him to tyranny and perdition.

  8. #8
    Senior Member rkspsm's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by mgtower View Post
    Agreed, however, I found the honor of good men can't be repudiated, whereas women can't be entrusted to hold true to an eternal scale, they meander and drift as time passes becoming reprobates in the process, like someone stuck in the mud going reverse and forward only to dig themselves in deeper, the mud being the lack of tangible honor (solid moral ground). They don't have a good internal compass, there's too much magnetic deviation, they can't see the world the way we do nor hold true and steady to any given direction.
    The society I live in, the fraction of men who have this notion of honor, is quite small.

    Quote Originally Posted by mgtower View Post
    My point is that men hold no legal advantage over you ...
    This is precisely the point where I was, very slightly, disagreeing. Yes the women have a major legal advantage over you. But there is also an advantage, albeit smaller, to a fraud man. He will con you and get away with it. There is very little you can do. You can go ahead and resort to physical violence, but then you will be in trouble. Its a reduced version of men vs women in family court, but its still there.

    And my point was, both these problems stem from a common root: the increased tolerance for lying, deceit and fraud compared to straight up violence. We are more likely to assume that the liar is innocent and had no means to research on what he/she was saying, whereas we will not assume the same for someone who resorted to physical violence out of necessity.

    And MGTOW community is not out of this. Look at the rules of this site, they specifically say about not advocating for PHYSICAL VIOLENCE towards women. Nothing is there about lying or defrauding women. That is the bias I was talking about. We hold physical violence an order of magnitude above on the severity scale compared to non-violent fraud.

    Physical violence is a male weapon of offense or retaliation. Lying is a female weapon of offense or retaliation, because they dont have physical capabilities to get down to fists fights in most cases. By lies and deceit, a weaker opponent will gain an advantage over a stronger opponent, like culture or courts or government, and THEN can resort to physical violence, or can get someone else do physical violence towards you (police). As long as we suppress the weapon which males have harder than we suppress the weapon females possess, we will hand over the power to them. The battle will be lost, before it even begins.
    "Truth is enough." - Curt Doolittle
    "Truth, and violence to enforce it." - Eli Harman

  9. #9

    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    While I agree with you that they seem to be winning at the moment, eventually the very lies that benefit them now will be the same that damns them later. Truth's victory is inevitable but as humans we tend to want things to attain their fruition before the due time so we can gloat ( nothing wrong with gloating just saying being invested in the outcome blinds us to the full picture).

  10. #10
    Senior Member Opaque's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    While I agree with you that they seem to be winning at the moment, eventually the very lies that benefit them now will be the same that damns them later. Truth's victory is inevitable but as humans we tend to want things to attain their fruition before the due time so we can gloat ( nothing wrong with gloating just saying being invested in the outcome blinds us to the full picture).
    No disrespect sir but this is purely wishful and naive thinking. Women know full well things will be harder in their later years when they live their lives manipulating men in their younger years. But so what!? They got to milk men while they were young, and in that sense they have ''won".

    It is like a man who gets milked several hundreds of dollars on expensive dinners and tries to comfort himself that he 'had a good evening, but we were not compatible'. hehe.... yea right with that money he could have enjoyed they highest quality pussy available on the market and probably got a threesome out of it if he payed the asking price.
    A mother cannot raise a boy to be a man, not because he needs a father figure; but because she favours team vagina over her own son.

    Tradcon women are the most manipulative of all kinds of women, because they infect you with false hope.
    Radfems are your best friend, because they hate you and verbalise it - that's honesty!

    The red pill rage is a process which takes many many years - so be kind and patient with yourself.

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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by African-Daoist View Post
    While I agree with you that they seem to be winning at the moment, eventually the very lies that benefit them now will be the same that damns them later. Truth's victory is inevitable but as humans we tend to want things to attain their fruition before the due time so we can gloat ( nothing wrong with gloating just saying being invested in the outcome blinds us to the full picture).
    In my more optimistic moments I take comfort in thoughts like this – the truth will out eventually. But unfortunately this is not being born out in any of my experiences. Lies do on occasion get revealed, but then they are obfuscated with more lies leaving the average Joe with absolutely no idea what to believe, or simply a complete disbelief in any new evidence.

    As an example ask anybody what they think about the phrase “history is written by the victors” implying that the full truth is not being told. Almost everybody you ask this of will agree vehemently saying things like “Of course it is, you can’t believe any of it 100%!”

    Yet have a discussion about any phase of history with the same people (without mentioning the above phrase) and they will recite what they have been led to believe with total confidence in its accuracy: “but we know this because that’s what all the ‘experts’ say!”

    In the same way all the lies and untruths we are experiencing today when uncovered by people like ourselves will be covered up by even more sinister lies.

    In my more pessimistic moments I see no end to it without a massive sea change, whatever form that may take.
    "Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

    All we can do is keep ourselves from all those who don't deserve it. – Dave Matthes

  12. #12
    Senior Member Opaque's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    In my more pessimistic moments I see no end to it without a massive sea change, whatever form that may take.
    Yup, it is like when many mgtow men say 'the welfare system cannot continue, women cannot keep having children and milking the state'. blah blah, 'it will collapse eventually right!?''

    But actually .gov just shifts ore resources to women, and tries to further manipulate the average productive man. If it comes down to it and things become so drastic, .gov will not hesitate to force men into labour camps to get society moving for the sake of women.

    Never take anything at face value.
    A mother cannot raise a boy to be a man, not because he needs a father figure; but because she favours team vagina over her own son.

    Tradcon women are the most manipulative of all kinds of women, because they infect you with false hope.
    Radfems are your best friend, because they hate you and verbalise it - that's honesty!

    The red pill rage is a process which takes many many years - so be kind and patient with yourself.

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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by Opaque View Post
    .gov will not hesitate to force men into labour camps to get society moving for the sake of women.
    It’s already happening, well the beginnings of it anyway.

    I’ve read stories about how in the U.S. some States / Municipalities are introducing new rules to the welfare system that mean you will lose your entitlements if you don’t do some sort of volunteer / charity work, yet they rarely force women onto these schemes because, for example, they have kids to look after.

    Here in Ireland there is a rule that your welfare will be stopped if you refuse to take up any position of employment or education recommended to you. The ‘education’ part is where they get you. They force you into what they term training courses to develop new skills. What they really are is two-fold:


    1. A way of manipulating unemployment figures – if you’re in training you’re not unemployed.
    2. Many of these ‘training’ courses are designed around teaching D.I.Y. skills which you put into practice by being forced to go out and ‘help the unfortunate’ with home repairs and upgrades. And guess who these ‘unfortunates’ typically are – that’s right, single moms who can’t do these things for themselves, and they pay not a penny for it.
    "Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

    All we can do is keep ourselves from all those who don't deserve it. – Dave Matthes

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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by Opaque View Post
    They got to milk men while they were young, and in that sense they have ''won".
    There is truth in these words, but more and more I see even the most devout blue-pillers turning away from relationships with women. They (women) may well have won the battle, but in their latter years they are coming to see that they have lost the war!
    "Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

    All we can do is keep ourselves from all those who don't deserve it. – Dave Matthes

  15. #15

    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by Opaque View Post
    No disrespect sir but this is purely wishful and naive thinking. Women know full well things will be harder in their later years when they live their lives manipulating men in their younger years. But so what!? They got to milk men while they were young, and in that sense they have ''won".

    It is like a man who gets milked several hundreds of dollars on expensive dinners and tries to comfort himself that he 'had a good evening, but we were not compatible'. hehe.... yea right with that money he could have enjoyed they highest quality pussy available on the market and probably got a threesome out of it if he payed the asking price.
    I think the glib way in which I made the statements about truth always winning might make it seem as though I was being unrealistic; so let me clarify what I meant.

    I think it was during my early days of becoming aware of the mgtow mindset that I became acquainted with a book titled fate of empires by John Glubb, based on his research into various empires he came to the conclusion (to paraphrase him): " societies who had attained a high level of opulence usually started to go against those principles that ensured their ascendence and eventually it would collapse under the weight of its own hubris".

    So to clarify, I was not saying that individual men would get some recompense for the injustice they have suffered but rather that a society which makes such a situation where the members of the collective have no incentive to seek to expand their civilisation's influence will eventually become unsustainable. I know it would e comforting to imagine that every woman who ever wronged us would suffer the penalty of their insolence but reality as you pointed out does not usually work that way. I read some meme which went something along the lines of " karma always pays those who do wrong and if we are lucky we might be there to watch". The thing is there really are consequences to our actions this much I am certain you would concede ? That being the case of course it seems as though what would be considered as immoral behaviour slips through the cracks but thats because societal morality does not necessarily equate to universal morality.
    What I mean is, truth is actually what could be considered as a universal standard, so if a society thinks that shiting on its most productive members will be a viable longterm strategy then it clearly did not get the memo. We are not ants or bees in a colony where there is only instinct and everyone follows the leader, even women when they are not fighting men are busy fighting each other to assert their dominance and independence even if that said independence is tied to the approval of the herd.

    All I am saying is that any model of society which is unsustainable without excessive enforcement through laws and threat of violence would eventually undermine itself.
    In engineering there is a concept of a source of energy only being viable if the energy required to harness it is not greater than what it produces. All human societies are based elementarily on these exchanges of energy at different levels .

    Not being aware of reality does not make a person automatically a good person it just makes one an easier prey. A man who consciously chooses to be good is quite different from a man who is "good " because society tells him to be.

    So to round up what I am saying, if enough men are burnt by the present dynamics of male-female interaction that strategy becomes unviable for subsequent females as the males adapt and the pendulum swings to the other end.

    If a meteor is about to fall on a particular community and the warnings of the resident astronomer is ignored because he is an outcast and has been branded a heretic because he opposes their insistence on staying I a location that would ensure their demise. Does their disdain of him or his mental anguish then change the trajectory of the meteor ? Even if he dies before it arrives, the inevitable will still manifest. Such is the nature of truth.cheers

  16. #16
    Senior Member rkspsm's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by African-Daoist View Post
    book titled fate of empires by John Glubb, based on his research into various empires he came to the conclusion (to paraphrase him): " societies who had attained a high level of opulence usually started to go against those principles that ensured their ascendence and eventually it would collapse under the weight of its own hubris".
    That is an awesome book which is near top in my "to-do list" of reading, though I am yet to start it. Heard so many people refer to it and recommend it !
    "Truth is enough." - Curt Doolittle
    "Truth, and violence to enforce it." - Eli Harman

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    Senior Member rkspsm's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by Opaque View Post
    Yup, it is like when many mgtow men say 'the welfare system cannot continue, women cannot keep having children and milking the state'. blah blah, 'it will collapse eventually right!?''

    But actually .gov just shifts ore resources to women, and tries to further manipulate the average productive man. If it comes down to it and things become so drastic, .gov will not hesitate to force men into labour camps to get society moving for the sake of women.

    Never take anything at face value.
    I agree with the point African Daoist made about decline, specifically I agree that decline is sure to happen, within 10 years or 100 or 500, that I cannot know. But your point actually highlights why its necessary to acknowledge that decline is inevitable. The scenario you stated, that is forcing men to work in labor camps, is exactly which we need to be aware of. We always need to keep in our minds that something of that sort might happen, and be prepared accordingly, mentally atleast if not physically. The mental preparation can go a long way in helping maintain a calm state of mind while figuring out solutions in case of emergencies. You are less anxious because you saw it coming, from a decade or two ago. And calm state of mind can lead to better solutions which you probably cannot think of otherwise when in state of shock.
    "Truth is enough." - Curt Doolittle
    "Truth, and violence to enforce it." - Eli Harman

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    Senior Member mgtower's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by rkspsm View Post
    I agree with the point African Daoist made about decline, specifically I agree that decline is sure to happen, within 10 years or 100 or 500, that I cannot know. But your point actually highlights why its necessary to acknowledge that decline is inevitable. The scenario you stated, that is forcing men to work in labor camps, is exactly which we need to be aware of. We always need to keep in our minds that something of that sort might happen, and be prepared accordingly, mentally atleast if not physically. The mental preparation can go a long way in helping maintain a calm state of mind while figuring out solutions in case of emergencies. You are less anxious because you saw it coming, from a decade or two ago. And calm state of mind can lead to better solutions which you probably cannot think of otherwise when in state of shock.
    I believe the next decline will be apocalyptic now that the world has gone global, only because we're all interdependent on each other. I think there'll be less people than there is kernels on an ear of corn. The odor of death will permeate every corner the planet. I always say think big, go big, or go home!

    In case you were wondering, I can take the heat, I'll be the one and only surviving kernel! The others are sure to pop! Then it'll truly my world! No more getting fucked!
    A man's only "safe space" be in his sovereignty, free from the illusions and misconceptions of a unity that only serves to bind him to tyranny and perdition.

  19. #19
    Senior Member rkspsm's Avatar
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    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by mgtower View Post
    I believe the next decline will be apocalyptic now that the world has gone global, only because we're all interdependent on each other. I think there'll be less people than there is kernels on an ear of corn. The odor of death will permeate every corner the planet. I always say think big, go big, or go home!

    In case you were wondering, I can take the heat, I'll be the one and only surviving kernel! The others are sure to pop! Then it'll truly my world! No more getting fucked!
    The two declines from history I hear a lot about are, the medieval dark ages, which began roughly from the downfall of Rome up until Renaissance, and then one another much earlier, the Late Bronze Age Collapse. I have heard, though not researched extensively, that the Bronze Age one was extremely brutal. Several entire prosperous civilizations were simply erased from the planet, only Egyptians survived, barely. Roman downfall was, again based on what I heard, and correct me if I am wrong, not nearly that bad. The Byzantine Empire, which was in many ways, the leftover Roman Empire, lived for several centuries before finally losing to Turks.

    I dont know why its the case, but one may hope, that whatever causes which reduced the severity of "dark ages", may play out again, and we may not crash that hard, or not every corner of the world crashes at the same time. But then again, I also think that rampant globalization, may make the next one a lot darker than ever.

    Regardless, there are people who are realizing this. Among those are people who have investment in the future, the future after their death, mostly because they want to do it for their kids. The resistance is developing out there. Even us are a form of resistance, though we tilt more towards black pilled side of things, again I believe, mostly because a lot of us dont really care about what happens after we are dead (nothing wrong with this, just stating it). But the thing is, those people out there who do care, are taking a much much more aggressive stance. The sentiments and vibe in their ecosystem makes it feel like some kind of holy order is forming to fight in a crusade. I myself have no investment in future after my death, but I am relatively young, so unless something kills me, I still have some decades as per usual life expectancy of humans, which is why movements like that make me curious to say the least, to see how it all turns out. Interesting times !
    "Truth is enough." - Curt Doolittle
    "Truth, and violence to enforce it." - Eli Harman

  20. #20

    Re: A Sense of Fair Play

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackoff View Post
    In my more optimistic moments I take comfort in thoughts like this – the truth will out eventually. But unfortunately this is not being born out in any of my experiences. Lies do on occasion get revealed, but then they are obfuscated with more lies leaving the average Joe with absolutely no idea what to believe, or simply a complete disbelief in any new evidence.

    As an example ask anybody what they think about the phrase “history is written by the victors” implying that the full truth is not being told. Almost everybody you ask this of will agree vehemently saying things like “Of course it is, you can’t believe any of it 100%!”

    Yet have a discussion about any phase of history with the same people (without mentioning the above phrase) and they will recite what they have been led to believe with total confidence in its accuracy: “but we know this because that’s what all the ‘experts’ say!”

    In the same way all the lies and untruths we are experiencing today when uncovered by people like ourselves will be covered up by even more sinister lies.

    In my more pessimistic moments I see no end to it without a massive sea change, whatever form that may take.

    You make a good point about our susceptibility to believe whichever version of events we are exposed to that is endorsed by those we would consider authorities.
    When I say truth I mean an acceptance and understanding of reality not how we wish it to be or think it is but without overlaying any expectation that things progress in a manner distinct from its present trajectory. I mean basically we all have this belief of our inherent goodness but if we go through our so called morals with a fine tooth comb, we realise hypocrisy should be our middle names. We lie when convenient, steal if it holds no repercussions( yes downloading a book not in the public domain from a pirate site is still theft), lust after our friends spouse but fear of rejection and not loss of the friendship hinders most etc.

    Not to sound like a moral busy body but most of these people who claim to be such moral paragons usually aren't. To even make such an assertion requires a lack of self awareness or a great level of awareness.

    Some lies in history might never even be discovered but I don't think that takes away from the fact that sustaining such a lie becomes more difficult the more layers that are added to obfuscate the true narrative, the more likely the whole edifice Is to come toppling down. So, yes while we might never know the truth of a lot of things that transpired in the past, for now it is enough for me to know that I am not basing my opinions on lies, so while its not as good as having the unvarnished truth its better than the alternative..cheers


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