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  1. #21
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    Re: REDPILL and mothers: Am I missing something, or is it my fault

    Quote Originally Posted by Malinois View Post
    First, I may be wrong but, why can’t someone (yourself) that’s college-educated spell better than a high school drop-out (myself)? Both of my little brothers have college degrees, and would dis-own me if I wrote that terrible…

    Maybe, English is your second language, I don’t know…

    Second. Are you a grown man or a boy?

    Do your own thing, and periodically pay your mother back for all of the help she’s given you with nice gifts, getting your own place, and lies about how you have a beautiful girlfriend.

    She will then, leave you alone, until she wants to meet your girlfriend and nags you to make grandchildren…But, you will have your own place, so you don’t have to answer the phone every time it rings…

    If you want to tweak her melon a little bit, to get her to back off then start dressing like a punk rocker, get a piece of crap car, and be smoking a joint next time you ring her doorbell…

    I think you’re still a boy because you choose to be. Get your own place, establish your own rules, and then you can get the respect a man deserves from his mommy…

    Oh, and by the way, the only woman that will ever love you is your mother. Because you are an extension of her, and women are naturally narcissistic…

    I’d be more concerned about earning my father’s respect, as he’s no-doubt, not been able to teach you man-things…

    All of you other dudes here need to take off the kid-gloves on these youngens…

    English is not my main language, probably that's why I write like a slightly drunk teenager. I have my own place, or to be more precise: rent my own place. Right know I am not so sure how can I afford a home in the city I live in.

    As for my mother: I am still equaly unconvinced that her "pressuring" was a healthy parent urge, or a possesive and maniulative female narcisism sho she could "talk about with other mothers from her work when they mention the grades of their children". Believe it or not, I have heard this.

    If i can conclude, I would write the thesis, because as one of the guys here saud - it wont hurt to have it, and as another said - it will put me in career disadvantage.

    However, I do understand why I can seem childish. A typical manly thing to do would be to just suck it up and do the thesis for the next available date. But they are only two dates for a year, and honnestly, when I started working and did some amazing progress in my job I totaly forgot about the diploma.

    Furthermore, sometimes I do feel like I am a bit childish: having more messy rooms than tidy ones, not training enough ( I do go to the gym and do tibetian exercises at home, but i can do better).

  2. #22
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    Re: REDPILL and mothers: Am I missing something, or is it my fault

    Quote Originally Posted by Unboxxed View Post
    2) Where is the Yes or No that I asked for? You make me have to read all of that and decide for you if it is a YES or a NO!

    Please try again to answer Question #2 as Yes or No.

    Thank you.
    My answer to question two is NO.

  3. #23
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    Re: REDPILL and mothers: Am I missing something, or is it my fault

    Quote Originally Posted by Malinois View Post
    All of you other dudes here need to take off the kid-gloves on these youngens…
    Maybe.

    But this guy doesn't strike me as needing a heavy hand, just a little guidance on where he stands at the moment.

    We may not be councellors, but most of us have had shit times in our lives. Offering a little guidance to our fellow man shouldn't be seen as weakness.

    But you're right, sometimes a cold sharp shock can be of far more benefit than long explanations.

    Discerning which course of action will be of more benefit to our fellow members is a bit of a dilemma isn't it?

  4. #24
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    Re: REDPILL and mothers: Am I missing something, or is it my fault

    Quote Originally Posted by MGTOW25 View Post
    My answer to question two is NO.
    Hi MGTOW 25,

    Thanks!

    At this time, as a new member please read our Principles by clicking on that word at the top of this page, in the black bar.

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    The two most important days in your life are the day you were born and the day you find out why. - Mark Twain

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  5. #25
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    Re: REDPILL and mothers: Am I missing something, or is it my fault

    Quote Originally Posted by MGTOW25 View Post
    As for my mother: I am still equaly unconvinced that her "pressuring" was a healthy parent urge, or a possesive and maniulative female narcisism sho she could "talk about with other mothers from her work when they mention the grades of their children". Believe it or not, I have heard this.

  6. #26
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    Re: REDPILL and mothers: Am I missing something, or is it my fault

    AWALT.

    Your mother nags: That's her way to get you motivated. She can't beat you or spank you anymore.

    Your mother knows what women are attracted to: Wealth and status. Diplomas are status that can help you get a good job for wealth.

    Women want kids: Now your mother wants grandchildren. She is trying to motivate you to a higher SMV to attract a future mother so you can give her grandchildren.

    Your mother was likely disappointed when you were born a boy. Having a girl would just about insure grandchildren.

  7. #27

    Re: REDPILL and mothers: Am I missing something, or is it my fault

    MGTOW25:

    What to do? Cut her off. Put her on pause.

    She is using SIGN language on you. She is using guilt ("I put you through college!") and shame ("Why don't you have your degree?")

    Write her a nice letter. Tell he you appreciate her help and acknowledge her sacrifices over the years. Include a check, perhaps equivalent to a few days' pay, maybe more.

    Send her a check, or deposit directly into her account. One way to stand out is to start small, and double it each time. Another way is to send it for some unusual amount, maybe one based on her birth day. Do it until "the debt" is paid.

    Paying the debt, undermines the guilt she can throw at you. It lessens the power she has over you.

    Outside of that, after you write that letter, have no contact. Do not call, email, or text her. Stop going to her place when you are not working. Instead, work on finishing that degree, but only because you want to, on your terms.

    Decide if you want to freeze her out for a six months, or a year. But do it until she realizes how she is hurting you, apologizes, and stops SIGN-ing you.

    She will call you. Use the most powerful weapon you have: silence.

    She will ask many questions. Respond with "yes" and "no" answers and nothing more. She will press you for updates on the degree. Do not answer any questions about that.

    Remember, you best response is long pauses and lots of silence on your part.

    You must be the Sphinx. You must be G. Gordon Liddy testifying before Congress. Do not engage, because once you do, the emotional manipulation will begin.

    After a while, she will try to call you and give you an emotional, but half-hearted "apology," and then try to go back to normal. If she does not acknowledge what she did to you, make amends, and promise to end the offensive behavior, she has not earned "normal." Because, after all, her "normal" is her emotional abuse of you.

    I will take a guess that you are from the Indian subcontinent. I, too, come from a culture where it is very important to be a "good" son. The duties of filial piety can be as heavy as a mountain. That is why you are making the bank deposits. Acknowledge the debt, address it, but it does not condemn you to a lifetime of emotional servitude.

    You will not have a good relationship with your mother until make her understand that what you currently have is not "good," but disrespectful.

    And if you can't have a relationship without the disrespect, then you don't need a relationship. You can fulfill your duties without the stress, guilt, and insult.

    I understand this might be difficult to do in your 20's, but if you do it, you will thank yourself for the next 30-40 years she is alive.
    An escort is a woman you occasionally financially support only when she has sex with you.

    A date is a woman you occasionally financially support in the hope she will have sex with you.

    A wife is a woman you constantly financially support even when she is not having sex with you.

    An ex-wife is a woman you constantly financially support with alimony so she can have sex......with someone else.

  8. #28

    Re: REDPILL and mothers: Am I missing something, or is it my fault

    Quote Originally Posted by MGTOW25 View Post
    I am a post grad, with more or less a good position in my career. However, i haven't obtained my diploma. I got all my exams, but failed to deliver the thesis on time, since by the time I had to write my thesis, I was already working (then remote working), got Covid and I feel ashamed for admiting this, but the girl I used to love, moved abroad and had a new life and a new bf. Seeing her instagram got me severly depressed as well. The weeks for the thesis I was overstressed - had to work a mindless job ( I didnt want to rely on my parents), I was sick and I was struck with the biggest hearthache I have ever got.
    Shit happens. It sounds like you were pressured into doing this diploma to please your mother and not for your own benefit, and you were working to support yourself at the same time while doing so. Don't feel bad, there are people out there who won't even get out of bed in the morning despite having everything virtually handed to them.

    Here is when it becomes funny: now I am working in the field that I studied in university, depsite not having the final diploma.
    So things worked out fine for you. Your mother should be happy that you're independent and thriving, right? Oh, wait...

    I hid this from my parents for nearly 2 years, until eventually I told them. I told my mother, that I lied to her, since I know how much she pressured me over grades during my 12 years in school, all the scandals until early in the monring for a bad grade, occaisonal beatings, limits on going out with friends. Basically, I had to be at home, alone, studying, and getting yelled at, called out gross names, suffer emtianal abuse and so on if i didn't meet her critieria.
    So your mother was abusive. Yeah, I know that her behaviour is more common in certain cultures, and is still even present in Western families, but it's still abusive.

    Yesterday me and my mother had an argument on when will I finally get my diploma.
    Are your financially independent from her? If you are then you don't need to argue with her, what you say goes when it comes to how you live your life.

    I am on vacation from work and I stay at my home town in her place.
    And there is your mistake. You minimize contact with controlling and abusive people, and you sure as hell don't live with them.


    Then she answred with details on how much she supported me while studying in a different city.
    So she doesn't care about what you want, only about getting a return on her 'investment'. You're essentially an expensive trophy for her to show off to her friends and extended family.

    Which is true, my father mostly did nothing for my upbringing especially financialy.
    She should have chosen a better man instead of living through her kid.

    Funny thing is, I would have never chosen this career path even tough it is interesting. It was suggested by her. Second, I was working during my second year in university - yeah, it was a student's job, but I got some money. However all the time she was nagging that - this is a stupid job, it is interfering with university and stuff.
    Money = independence from her, and she can't have that.

    So my question is - why do mothers feel entitled to expect and demand succes from their sons.
    Not just mothers, and not just sons. Many parents view that children as extensions of themselves, trophies for bragging rights, or sophisticated art projects. They view them the same way you might view a prize race horse. Sure, you might invest a lot of money to keep that horse healthy, but you don't give a shit how the horse feels about running around showgrounds and jumping over hay bales.

    Her point was that - "For me being healthy, alive and working is not enough, I think it is nomral.
    You're going to have to slowly condition yourself to not give a shit what your mother thinks. I know this is incredibly hard given that she had almost complete control over you for 18+ years and ruthlessly used that control to mould you into the person you are today. The first step is keeping your distance from her. Only once you remove yourself from a swamp can you work on removing the stink from yourself.


    1) woman's love is conditional - yes, even your mother's
    Everyone's love is conditional IMHO. Look at any adult who wants to be a parent, they will almost always conceive their own child rather than adopt. Indeed, they may go through years of IVF therapy just to conceive, rather than help existing kids who need parents. Why? Partly because they want the child to have their DNA. They will only 'love' the child if it comes from them.

    2) my father's deficits and especially monetary deficits put a burden on me to excell
    Your mother is definitely trying to make a statement to the world via you.

    3) the fact that she really helped financially for a huge junk of my life gives her a reason to demand stuff
    When you bring a kid into this world knowing it will be fully dependent on you to survive and thrive through no fault of its own, then you have an obligation to financially support it and make sure they 'succeed to launch' into adulthood. That your father ducked out on his obligation isn't your problem, it's your mother's.

    Raising a kid isn't like some Mafioso deal where you do someone vulnerable a 'favor' and then you call on them at an unexpected date to cash in on it by having them do something onerous or illegal. You aren't your mother's slave, you aren't her art project, you're an independent human being. You never signed a contract when you were conceived that you were going to be her magnum opus.

    If you're feeling real guilty about the money she spent on your college, then just pay her that back. If she continues to try and control you then you can just cut her out of your life guilt-free. After all, she can take the money you gave her to go and get her own college diploma and high-flying job, but I'm guessing she won't because that will be too hard. It's so much easier to browbeat someone else into doing the hard work instead of doing it yourself, which is why so many people own shares but not their own business.

    What are your thoughts about this? Maybe I am at fault?
    No. Even if you failed your diploma due to not trying I wouldn't really blame you, since it's clear you were pressured into it, we all mess up occasionally and scrape the curb in life, and you still went on to become financially independent with a good career despite a less than stellar upbringing. Life is messy and you haven't committed any mistakes that will cripple you, such as incurring massive debt, ending up in prison, or having kids you can't support.

    without her gentle advise on me choosing a career,
    Gentle advice? Hah.

    Even if she didn't 'force' you into the career, parents like your mother will say you can choose to walk whatever path you want, while having a hand on your shoulder to 'guide' you down the paths they want, and withhold love and affection when you make decisions they don't agree with. This is brutal when it's someone you love and want approval from.

    I currently like my place in life, which would be impossible withouth my mother's support or even entitelment to good grades.

    edit: typos
    Your mother gave you what you were entitled to as a child, and she could have done that without the abuse and continued controlling well into your adulthood. Once you've left the nest she has no right to clip your wings. IMHO you don't owe her shit, not even a visit or phone call if she's going to continue to make you feel like you're a failure despite actually functioning as an independent successful adult.

  9. #29

    Re: REDPILL and mothers: Am I missing something, or is it my fault

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackoff View Post
    As for your mom, she gave you a direction. Maybe she was overbearing at times, maybe she still is, I canít say, but wouldnít it have been worse if she didnít give a shit and allowed you run rampant with no direction at all?
    Joe Jackson used a similar argument to justify his childhood abuse of Michael Jackson. The vicious physical abuse, Gestapo like control and relentless practice were justified because Michael Jackson ended up rich, while some kids in the neighbourhood who weren't subjected to the same treatment ended up doing drugs or joining gangs. And of course some people ate up that rationalization like gravy, although I doubt those same people would willingly subject themselves to Joe Jackson's 'methods' or volunteer to have his childhood for a single solitary second.

    Applying pressure to your kid to do well academically is OK, how it is done is often a grey area. But what is black and white is that once your kid is an independent adult you no longer get to play the 'parent' card to browbeat them into conforming to the lifestyle that you would like for them. You don't get to tell them they owe it to you to get that extra accreditation or promotion, you don't get to make them feel guilty for being 'ordinary' when you wanted them to be 'extraordinary'. That's a bridge to far and crosses the line into overly controlling behaviour.

    I think this scene from "Guess Who's Coming to Dinner" sums it up quite nicely:



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