Thread: Rant: Most men will never learn

I just need to let off some steam, so don´t expect any deep thoughts here.

A co-worker broke up with his girlfriend a few weeks ago. He told me about it and he seemed to be fed up, we talked a bit, but I didn´t out myself as a MGTOW. She had moved into his place, then they were seperated and she found herself an apartement. Now they are back together again and he is already planning a vacation with her. (At least she has not moved in with him again!)

Today we were talking about relationships in general and he was telling me that he could very well imagine to get married and have children. YEAH!

Some men will never learn. They don´t want to learn. Because the sacred pussy is oh so valuable. I lost a great deal of respect for that guy today. (He is a good guy in general but I assume that he might be able to throw another man under the bus to "defend" a woman....but maybe I am wrong here.)

Later this evening I was watching a video of an MRA who wanted to attend a feminist meeting and he wanted to bring a video camera with him to protect himself against false accusations of disturbing the event or some feminists who might lie about things he said. A reasonable and wise decision in my opinion. In the end, the feminists bullied him out of that event by accusing him to be threatening them to cause trouble (which he didn´t do!) and they came up with a "policy" which demands that he has insurance when he brings a camera (he doesn´t have that insurance). They didn´t want him there and they bullied him away. Nothing new here! They used censorship to "protect" the poor wimminz! YEAH!!!

And some MRAs tell MGTOW men that they are too negative because they avoid women in general and that they need to be constructive instead. LOL

Over the last decades, men have tried to build bridges for women and offered to communicate with them to sort out their issues. They offered them a helping hand and they got spit in the face again and again. And most men just continue doing this.

Sorry if this posting doesn´t make any sense. I am pretty angry at the moment and I just needed to vent.

P.S. Don´t get me wrong. I admire MRAs for their patience and what they are doing. And I agree with most of the things they say.

No problem, GK. We've created the Rant sub-forum for these kinds of posts, but I'll leave this here.

Once your eyes are opened, it becomes harder to engage in the blue pill world; there is frustration in seeing someone subject themselves to the pointless strife that relationships often introduce. Those that haven't seen the light must fumble in the darkness and there's precious little one can do about it. Just think what's going through the Dalai Lama's head when he's attained enlightenment but sees a guy in the street curse about the weather. There will continue to be this dissonance for a while; just be grateful you've made the leap. Some of the others will. Others will never. Over time, you'll develop a detachment which will insulate you from the madness you observe in others.

It's social programming.

When a man is taught by his father(if he has one) , his mother, and his friends that his existence is expendable compared to the Almighty Pussy,that's exactly what he'll do. Our voices don't matter compared the combined might of family and social pressure.

Originally Posted by Octavian

It's social programming.

When a man is taught by his father(if he has one) , his mother, and his friends that his existence is expendable compared to the Almighty Pussy,that's exactly what he'll do. Our voices don't matter compared the combined might of family and social pressure.

This. Some guys can never see past the social mores on which they were raised, not feeling "complete" without female companionship. We have all seen friends we care about get their A$$ hammered by women, I'd bet.
Just support him if he needs it and let your own peaceful, drama free life be his compass. Maybe he'll catch on.

Originally Posted by jagrmeister

There will continue to be this dissonance for a while; just be grateful you've made the leap. Some of the others will. Others will never. Over time, you'll develop a detachment which will insulate you from the madness you observe in others.

That seems to be the hardest step. I live in the city, attend classes in a campus full of this societal bullshit and literally swim through outmoded and flawed logic on a daily basis. This constant and overwhelming contradiction can be painful sometimes.

Ultimately what keeps me steadfast to my beliefs and motivated is that we are playing the game of life on hard mode. That is what makes this mindset much more gratifying in the end.

Unfortunately there's nothing to do except admit that you are powerless: as jagrmeister said, you become detached enough eventually to forget about it. You have your own life in order, and that's more than most people will ever attain.

Originally Posted by GabrielKnight

Don´t get me wrong. I admire MRAs for their patience and what they are doing. And I agree with most of the things they say.

I don't wish to risk the wrath of Jagr, but I'm sorry, I do not subscribe to this. The MRA's are attempting to find a compromising middle ground with the feminazis and the reality is that there cannot be any, they are a clear and present danger to our entire society and if they aren't stopped, they will destroy it.

The only way to fight the feminazis is with the things they fear the most, destroying their lies, bullshit and fantasies with facts - only the truth will set us free (men, women and children)

To be quite honest with you, I would put the MRA's in the same capacity as the appeasement movement in Europe during the 1930's. This is a battle for survival, not just of men, but our whole civilisation and at the moment we are outnumbered, isolated and overwhelmed, but this has been true of many historical movements who have gone on to win in the end from Alexander the Great to Winston Churchill.

Originally Posted by FapMaster

This. Some guys can never see past the social mores on which they were raised, not feeling "complete" without female companionship. We have all seen friends we care about get their A$$ hammered by women, I'd bet.
Just support him if he needs it and let your own peaceful, drama free life be his compass. Maybe he'll catch on.

You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make it drink.

"Later this evening I was watching a video of an MRA who wanted to attend a feminist meeting and he wanted to bring a video camera with him to protect himself against false accusations of disturbing the event or some feminists who might lie about things he said"

Why would he even go right into the shark tank like that? What the fuck did he think he could possibly achieve for his cause? Do MRAs believe they can reason with feminists, perhaps change their minds?

"And some MRAs tell MGTOW men that they are too negative because they avoid women in general and that they need to be constructive instead."
Ha ha ha....HA! Constructive, indeed. They kicked him out of there. They wanted absolutely NO dialogue with this male. In my opinion what MGTOWs and the Herbivores are doing is way more constructive, at least towards changing women's expectations of men, by CUTTING THEM OFF! Refuse to participate in marriage and having kids, and ESPECIALLY in "siring" (laughs) another thug's mini-me. Cut them off, stop buying women dinner, don't remember how long you've dated or anniversaries, gradually teach them what to expect from us, not them teach us what they should expect from us. By even going to a feminist gathering he is giving them the attention they want and legitimizing them. Just stop paying attention to them and they will buzz off.

I wanted to discuss this as a separate MGTOW sub-philosophy thread.

Why is there not space for MGTOWs of every persuasion? I personally took up this philosophy before I knew it had a name, and chose my path: My way. I won't let anyone step all over me at their will. However, I have not excepted the possibility that I will get married and have children. It's not very likely, but it's possible. With copious prenuptial agreements and legal protections abound, just as I would ANY other business partnership. All women who want that place in my life will act exactly as I need, and not a sliver less. At any point I feel I have enough proof (since women are okay with a preponderance of evidence, I get it too. Equality, right?) that the relationship, my home or my family are not taken care of by her properly as I demand, I will simply drop it.

It sounds rough, but the fact is I carry much more value than any woman (save for my mother - She has 3 boys. It's difficult to stay a feminist when you can see the effect in your own home) in my life. I am also willing to do what is proper and more in a relationship, but not to a girl who thinks everything is only about her.

What says these philosophies can not be tolerated under the branch of MGTOW, or even toleration of all MRAs? Yes, we have MRAs trying to bargain with feminists. I would argue the closest we have to such is Dr. Warren Farrell. Or, if I were to make a benchmark as that, I would make everyone in such a position come to Dr. Farrell's level. He will not be affected by bullshit, but he is also not closed off to working with the opposing side as long as they're willing to actually come halfway. Personally, I tolerate those who wish to try to work with the feminazis, but I really wish they wouldn't. I would rather those same people instead take that energy to offer support for all Men and Boys.

Feminism was born of greed and envy. It needs to end. We shouldn't work with feminists, but we should also be inclusive, and embrace these philosophies other may not agree with. Personally, I would love to use stereotypically PUA techniques to break them out of feminism. Which is why I believe it should be tolerated. We shouldn't restrict ourselves in any form. Activists can restrict themselves by their ethics if they want, but we're not activists. Just active with our lives.

GabrielKnight: Not much can be said about your mate - pussy-worshipers gonna worship... until the day comes if/when they don't, which tends to be a totally personal thing that you can't do much about. Re: your MRA point, I've come to see it like this:-

MRAs are on their own path, and generally do more good than harm, in the struggle against gynocentrism/misandry [see below post]; so more power to their elbows. It may be that their energies might be better spent elsewhere, but that's their choice to make, not anybody else's. I'm sick to the back teeth of that Leftist-style 'telling others what they 'should' do' shit.

The main failure has been men/Civilisation failing the mother of all shit-tests, due to their innate nature to worship and protect women, which has been coldly and relentlessly used as the primary weapon against them for decades. On t'other hand, I don't see the constant offering of in good faith discourse as a failure; and is in fact a testament to male nobility and virtue: It is a continual, real-world demonstration of how much we men really do occupy the moral high-ground.

One of my biggest struggles, as a MGHOW, is balancing my 'Feck it, let it all burn - gone fishin'!' side with my life-long crafting of my self into being the best ethical being that I can, with a profound love and admiration of the more Classical Western/male virtues... which I feel must be preserved and actively fought for.

The continued offering of in good faith discourse to the enemy (especially an enemy as uniformly disgusting and honourless as ours), is one of those things (however possibly futile) that fills me with pride... I've often thought [purely IMO] that MGTOW can sometimes be too quick to 'chuck the baby out with the bathwater', as they redefine masculinity [and I say this despite being about the most hardcore 'starve the beast' ghost that it's possible to be]. But that's a big subject for another day.

Our Man in Penang: "I would put the MRA's in the same capacity as the appeasement movement in Europe during the 1930's."

I guess that the key, important difference is influence/power. If the day ever comes when MRAs have the same influence/power as the appeasement movement had, only then will it really become an issue - until then, MGTOW shooting at MRAs, and vice versa, does more harm than good. I'm also not convinced that most MRAs actually do want appeasement, in the same way that the appeasement movement did.

Eg, a core part of the appeasement movement was in not attacking the core ideology and excesses of Naziism (the UK PTB even going so far as to ban films that had been made that did expose and condemn these things - which were then only released once we'd declared war). I'm not too familiar with any MRAs who don't fervently expose, deconstruct, and condemn the ideological root and excess of Feminism? In fact, don't MRAs tend to do this more than MGTOW do, in general?

Fidelbogen, Victor Zen, GWW, Typhon Blue, JtO - not sure that there are many MGTOW equivalents of these?

* * *

College MGTOW: Yeah, after a few years I'm done with the internecine feuds. There really are important differences between the fuzzy clusters of folk along the pro-male/anti-Feminist scale, but I'd like to see most of the places on that scale as options that pro-male men may freely enjoy, as they flit from place to place as they see fit - rather than as adversaries.

My home with my brothers will always be found in the likes of HQ and here, but I also enjoy the broad diversity of opinions in the YT pro-male/anti-Feminist (and anti-Leftist) sphere. AVfM isn't my bag, personally, but there's no real reason why a MGHOW shouldn't be able to chat there too, if he ever wants, and vice versa. I had a bit of a crack at seeing if it was possible for a MGHOW to have a decent and civil chat over there, the other day/s... won't say that it was the warmest and easiest conversation I've ever had, but we reached an amicable farewell and understanding in the end. Needs a few more stepping-stones in that river of bad blood, to be fair, but there are possibilities there.

I'm personally, heartily sick of the circular firing squad. I can only imagine how zed feels.