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  1. #1
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    What makes an alpha male?

    We all have notions about what it means to be alpha / beta, we even have phrases like alpha fucks / beta bucks that help (hinder?) us in understanding the differences but these mostly only describe the consequences.

    I came across this vid and found it interesting. Itís 16 minutes long and explains it through the animal world which is where the term originated. This has the benefit of being able to consider the notion without the emotions attached to when we describe it in humans.


  2. #2
    Senior Member happybachelor's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Type A and B is about personality type.

    This guy explains it well. I encourage you to watch the first 30 mins at least, many men lack this basic understanding of the two personality types.

    https://www.bitchute.com/video/9KjmohoAK0W1/

    Type A is the 'asshole' because he is fundamentally opposed to any order which seeks to control him. Women are attracted on a primal level, but that's it, their intellect quickly dissociates that because she can tell he won't give her what she seeks, which is control. Type A will stand alone against the world for a principle, they tend to value sincerity and truth even (what seems to others to be) to their own detriment.
    Type B men are any that are not the above. Your own life experience should corroborate that the Type A is a minority.
    Type Bs can look or seem 'alpha' but they are really not. They are happy with deceiving, they care more about appearances, and are happy to serve a woman. So women are actually happier with a Type B. They have been conditioned by the media to reject real men (which the Type A more represents) and to reward the servile, weak and insincere men.
    As Alex explains, the ultimate catch for a woman is the Type B personality type with the attractive look, even a look that many people consider 'alpha' - which is wrong because the types have nothing to do with anything other than personality. An example could be an aggressive cage fighter covered in tats.. 99% of people would assume this guy is an alpha but they will very often be wrong.
    Last edited by happybachelor; June 6, 2021 at 5:55 PM.
    Alpha male with a warrior spirit.
    Follower of Christ.
    Take the established 'truth' as far as society is concerned and go 180 degrees from that... there you will find the truth. Society is ass-backwards and your job is undoing all that BS you were programmed with your entire life.
    When men choose not to believe in God, they do not thereafter believe in nothing. They then become capable of believing in anything.


  3. #3
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Quote Originally Posted by happybachelor View Post
    Type A and B is about personality type.

    This guy explains it well. I encourage you to watch the first 30 mins at least, many men lack this basic understanding of the two personality types.

    https://www.bitchute.com/video/9KjmohoAK0W1/
    I nearly turned this off after the first few minutes, his whole attitude seemed off to me somehow. It took a moment to realise that it was because his motivations for understanding women stem from wanting a relationship with one himself. He declared himself and ALL men incels within the first 3 minutes. But because of your recommendation to watch at least the first 30 mins I persevered.

    There were things I agreed with him on and there things I didn’t – no real surprise there since no-one has all the answers and we’re coming from different standpoints, so we’re likely to see things differently. But it was this bit that got me:

    At 44 mins he says he

    laughs at these MGTOWS that run around saying they don’t need women and they spend their time improving themselves – IMPROVING THEMSELVES FOR WHAT?
    The implication being that the only possible motivation for self-improvement in men is to impress women, which he then goes on to reinforce:

    They go on about how much money they have and how they own their own homes and how happy they are – NAH, they would much rather give up everything they own and be in a traditional relationship.
    And then he goes on to say that we’re all miserable.

    Shows how much he knows about people’s motivations! It was shortly after this I switched off.

    He’s a self-confessed incel and his bitterness is evident. His reasoning revolves around women and what women want in order to have a meaningful relationship with them, or more accurately why he can’t. He just can’t comprehend the fact that most other men simply don’t share his view. The guy’s an idiot locked in to a particular world view. He’s an angry little man because women won’t respond to him the way he wants them to respond. It’s all on them and TPTB that have warped their minds. It’s not his fault at all.

    There is little to nothing anyone can learn from this guy other than bitterness.

    Quote Originally Posted by happybachelor View Post
    Type A is the 'asshole' because he is fundamentally opposed to any order which seeks to control him. Women are attracted on a primal level, but that's it, their intellect quickly dissociates that because she can tell he won't give her what she seeks, which is control. Type A will stand alone against the world for a principle, they tend to value sincerity and truth even (what seems to others to be) to their own detriment.
    Type B men are any that are not the above. Your own life experience should corroborate that the Type A is a minority.
    Type Bs can look or seem 'alpha' but they are really not. They are happy with deceiving, they care more about appearances, and are happy to serve a woman. So women are actually happier with a Type B. They have been conditioned by the media to reject real men (which the Type A more represents) and to reward the servile, weak and insincere men.
    As Alex explains, the ultimate catch for a woman is the Type B personality type with the attractive look, even a look that many people consider 'alpha' - which is wrong because the types have nothing to do with anything other than personality. An example could be an aggressive cage fighter covered in tats.. 99% of people would assume this guy is an alpha but they will very often be wrong.
    This is the bit I basically agreed with him on although even here he is thinking in relationship terms. He totally ignores the female desire to simply fuck, or more accurately get fucked by, an Alpha.
    Last edited by Jackoff; June 7, 2021 at 4:11 PM.

  4. #4
    Senior Member rkspsm's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackoff View Post
    I came across this vid and found it interesting. It’s 16 minutes long and explains it through the animal world which is where the term originated. This has the benefit of being able to consider the notion without the emotions attached to when we describe it in humans.
    That was very cool video. Several things that caught my attention, some of them were :

    - It was awesome to hear that the chimps bringing food and pillows for their sick former alpha, this is the best relationship between the ruler and ruled !! Sadly, its too ideal for most scenarios in human world that it almost sounds like a fairy tale.

    - The similarities in postures and actions between alphas and humans !!!

    - Last but not least, the male chimps would go hungry for a week for sex... yeah okay... thats pure desperation !
    Unless stated otherwise, I am NOT presenting my preferences.

    Preferences can be views, thoughts, opinions, philosophies, morals, values, ideology, imaginations, fantasies, fictions, god, soul, spirit...

    I am using scientific method, its an algorithmic computation, designed to give highest efficiency and chance to win in a conflict, at a very high cost of mental discomfort of not adhering to preferences and spending time and energy on the computation.

  5. #5
    Senior Member happybachelor's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    It is important to understand, when he talks about MGTOW in those terms, he is specifically talking about the type B personality MGTOW. I don't agree they are all miserable - many have learned to live contentedly. But in a sense he is right, type Bs are not happy because they have been denied their fulfilment which is being in a monogamous relationship. He goes on later to show how much he empathises with these men because he knows how impossible it has become for men, and crucially he understands the nefarious force behind this particular 'operation' - which it is.
    There is little to nothing anyone can learn from this guy other than bitterness.
    You're very wrong here, in my opinion. The guy has opened my eyes more than anyone else.

    A lot of men claiming to be red pilled are nothing of the sort. There are reasons why all the shit in our culture is happening, and they are mostly engineered. Engineered means someone conceived it, planned it and executed it. Behind this lies a motive. You cannot call yourself red pilled if you believe these things are natural, accidental or coincidental, and that there is no motive and coordinated force making it all happen. Because that is the truth and to be red pilled is to be aware of the truth.
    Alpha male with a warrior spirit.
    Follower of Christ.
    Take the established 'truth' as far as society is concerned and go 180 degrees from that... there you will find the truth. Society is ass-backwards and your job is undoing all that BS you were programmed with your entire life.
    When men choose not to believe in God, they do not thereafter believe in nothing. They then become capable of believing in anything.


  6. #6
    Senior Member rkspsm's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Quote Originally Posted by happybachelor View Post
    Type A and B is about personality type.

    This guy explains it well. I encourage you to watch the first 30 mins at least, many men lack this basic understanding of the two personality types.
    Hahaha !! Holy shit, he started with a very in-your-face bazooka !!! That alone sold it to me !

    I havent watched all of it, yet. Only like 21 minutes. And I agree with him on all the points (yet). The problem with his classification is, or I shouldnt say a problem because I dont think he sees it as a problem and neither does me, but its still something I'd like to comment on.

    His classification of Alpha vs Beta is VERY different from many other classifications. An overwhelmingly majority of people on this planet are Type B / Beta according to his classification. The central point of his classification is conflict !!! Now I have one possible explanation for that (read: a theory / hypothesis, not a "truth"), but before that I'd like to say his classification and him saying it will do two things :

    1. Because its distribution is extremely skewed, its kindda useless for most of the people. They are all falling in Beta category, left, right and center. So, atleast in first 20 minutes, all he said to them was, "you are all just the same as women".

    2. And not only that most of them are clumped together into one group, he talks of them as being inferior. Now I am myself neutral on the topic (more on this later), but he will make the people feel so bad because he just labelled them "Beta". Now a Beta being Beta, according to his definition, will immediately resort to feelz of the word "Beta", and those feelz arent particularly good...

    So those he classifies as Alpha, they will be smiling or laughing by this point. I know I was, I LOOOVE conflict, and especially the intellectual one, like he said. Heck, he even mentions my height correctly, I am indeed a 5 feet 6 !

    But I'd like to mention one little advantage the conflict avoider (the Beta in his classification) has in times of extreme comfort. Extreme comfort implies abundance of resources. So a conflict avoider is basically optimizing the energy. There is no NEED to resolve any conflict, one can just ignore everything and just grab the resources available. But as times get worse, conflict becomes unavoidable because all resources get consumed up, which is happening right very this moment. Every passing day, the unavoidable conflict is becoming more and more intense, and more and more "unavoidable".

    He is very right about women feeling threatened by the conflict lover (the Alpha in his classification). Like the alpha he describes, I have zero tolerance for bs. I will take a very aggressive stance without actually swearing at them (which can cause me trouble). To this date, even the toughest and smartest of those "self categorized alpha" women I have met, it takes me no more than few minutes to destroy any illusion they have of their ability to rhetoric and debate, and after that point its a constant uphill fight for them, and THEY DONT LIKE THAT.

    And its not just the women, the males also dont like that. I mean, just for the comparison of how ridiculously skewed the distribution is, in my real life, of ALL the people I have interacted with, ONLY ONE I have found who is willing to persist through the relentless intellectual assault, and sometimes even win !
    Unless stated otherwise, I am NOT presenting my preferences.

    Preferences can be views, thoughts, opinions, philosophies, morals, values, ideology, imaginations, fantasies, fictions, god, soul, spirit...

    I am using scientific method, its an algorithmic computation, designed to give highest efficiency and chance to win in a conflict, at a very high cost of mental discomfort of not adhering to preferences and spending time and energy on the computation.

  7. #7

    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Quote Originally Posted by rkspsm View Post
    Hahaha !! Holy shit, he started with a very in-your-face bazooka !!! That alone sold it to me !

    I havent watched all of it, yet. Only like 21 minutes. And I agree with him on all the points (yet). The problem with his classification is, or I shouldnt say a problem because I dont think he sees it as a problem and neither does me, but its still something I'd like to comment on.

    His classification of Alpha vs Beta is VERY different from many other classifications. An overwhelmingly majority of people on this planet are Type B / Beta according to his classification. The central point of his classification is conflict !!! Now I have one possible explanation for that (read: a theory / hypothesis, not a "truth"), but before that I'd like to say his classification and him saying it will do two things :

    1. Because its distribution is extremely skewed, its kindda useless for most of the people. They are all falling in Beta category, left, right and center. So, atleast in first 20 minutes, all he said to them was, "you are all just the same as women".

    2. And not only that most of them are clumped together into one group, he talks of them as being inferior. Now I am myself neutral on the topic (more on this later), but he will make the people feel so bad because he just labelled them "Beta". Now a Beta being Beta, according to his definition, will immediately resort to feelz of the word "Beta", and those feelz arent particularly good...

    So those he classifies as Alpha, they will be smiling or laughing by this point. I know I was, I LOOOVE conflict, and especially the intellectual one, like he said. Heck, he even mentions my height correctly, I am indeed a 5 feet 6 !

    But I'd like to mention one little advantage the conflict avoider (the Beta in his classification) has in times of extreme comfort. Extreme comfort implies abundance of resources. So a conflict avoider is basically optimizing the energy. There is no NEED to resolve any conflict, one can just ignore everything and just grab the resources available. But as times get worse, conflict becomes unavoidable because all resources get consumed up, which is happening right very this moment. Every passing day, the unavoidable conflict is becoming more and more intense, and more and more "unavoidable".

    He is very right about women feeling threatened by the conflict lover (the Alpha in his classification). Like the alpha he describes, I have zero tolerance for bs. I will take a very aggressive stance without actually swearing at them (which can cause me trouble). To this date, even the toughest and smartest of those "self categorized alpha" women I have met, it takes me no more than few minutes to destroy any illusion they have of their ability to rhetoric and debate, and after that point its a constant uphill fight for them, and THEY DONT LIKE THAT.

    And its not just the women, the males also dont like that. I mean, just for the comparison of how ridiculously skewed the distribution is, in my real life, of ALL the people I have interacted with, ONLY ONE I have found who is willing to persist through the relentless intellectual assault, and sometimes even win !
    I think there has been a mixing up of the desire to mate with a desire for monogamy.
    Truth be told, a lot of men would be just as willing to have a polygamous situation if they could afford it financially and incur no stigma.


    One thing that the feminists might have gotten right is the impact that certain media have upon the expectations of people of a more immature mind frame. Usually, people were able to outgrow the teenage flights of fancy and settle into acceptance that reality can never match whatever is in their heads.

    Now while in the case of women there seems to have been an obvious negative impact with excessive selectiveness and princess syndrome, men have to a large extent not been spared, but it's not blatantly obvious, so it seems benign .
    But I think it's the feedback mechanism that helps this loop of delusion continue along it's trajectory.


    I think a lot of men, especially the below 40's, that grew up during the disney and RomCom era, have a twisted perception of themselves, as some sorts of knights in shining armor or even a prince charming . They will save the damsel, even if it kills them.
    The thing is, the "princesses " also are holding out for their prince charming and knight in shining armor, not this mere peasant clad in bits of metal.



    In the long run though, most of these men expect a woman can provide some meaning and radiance to their lives but they fail to comprehend that no one can create a purpose for another, without in some sense crippling their very soul.It's ironic that the kind of men who could keep women in a state of adventure, whether intellectual, physical or spiritual, usually end up gay, bachelor or celibate.


    I don't blame a lot of men though for their assumption that they can succeed where others have failed. It's like Neitszche said, " courage is a form of stupidity " . A lot of the adventure men pursue comes from a desire not to accept the status quo and some have succeeded, where a lot more have failed, but in our optimistic mind set, we mostly notice the successes, rather than the pile of skeletons that preceded a single triumph.



    In the end I think not until enough men have been through the wringer can there be any change in the way things are, because most people have to learn through pain.


    I don't really buy the whole alpha-beta dichotomy though, because it seems too simplistic to categorize all of male humans into just these two spheres, I think reality is often more complex than that. Agreeableness though is something that can be measured and it seems that has become common in a lot of modern men.


    To summarize my points, it seems a lot of men have a wrong perception of reality, hence their poor decisions.
    It's not even inherently the desire for a mate but the desire to mate, which has been hijacked by the new priesthood of academia and they now preach the doctrine of he who is too weak to be married should stay single ! A diametrically opposite stance from most religious or spiritual doctrines. If you start from the assumptions, it's easier to see the necessary correlates that follow.

    Cheers

  8. #8
    Senior Member rkspsm's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Quote Originally Posted by African-Daoist View Post
    ...
    I think a lot of men, especially the below 40's, that grew up during the disney and RomCom era, have a twisted perception of themselves, as some sorts of knights in shining armor or even a prince charming . They will save the damsel, even if it kills them.
    The thing is, the "princesses " also are holding out for their prince charming and knight in shining armor, not this mere peasant clad in bits of metal.

    In the long run though, most of these men expect a woman can provide some meaning and radiance to their lives but they fail to comprehend that no one can create a purpose for another, without in some sense crippling their very soul.It's ironic that the kind of men who could keep women in a state of adventure, whether intellectual, physical or spiritual, usually end up gay, bachelor or celibate.
    ...

    To summarize my points, it seems a lot of men have a wrong perception of reality, hence their poor decisions.
    Yes, what you were trying to say from disney and RomCom era is the same as what I said about times of comfort, abundance of resources. The perception of reality is a twisted one because no abundance ever lasts. The humans, like any other animal, tend to out reproduce any excess and we go back to the crisis. So the error which needs to be corrected, and it will be corrected eventually, is that those "save the damsel in distress" minded men will realized that the crisis is real, and there is (or will be) no way to save the princesses.

    Quote Originally Posted by African-Daoist View Post
    I don't really buy the whole alpha-beta dichotomy though, because it seems too simplistic to categorize all of male humans into just these two spheres, I think reality is often more complex than that. Agreeableness though is something that can be measured and it seems that has become common in a lot of modern men.
    Agreed that its too simplistic. This was also my point that the way he classified, one side is very small and other too big to be of any use to them. But regardless of the simplicity, he still defined it quite clearly and from what I have watched stayed with his definition. I am fine with that. If you need to redefine some terms to convey your meaning, and as long as you dont stray too far from their assumed meaning, its good. This is why I used the phrases like "Alpha, according to HIS classification" and "Beta, according to HIS classification".

    The second thing I'd say, that in any sort of classification, there will be some "inferior" groups. And there will be people who will be categorized into that group, regardless of how they feel about it. In his classification the beta is inferior in some regards, and most of the people are beta with that definition. It is what it is. Feeling bad about it, instead of challenging any consistency of his classification, is simply more evidence to the very point he makes : Alpha: Conflict, Beta: Feelz.

    I know many other classifications, the one I like the most is these :

    1. IQ : Your natural intellectual "horsepower". The higher it is, the more subtle patterns you can identify and then use them to predict things and solve more problems. This is fixed from birth and doesnt change much. But do note that this doesnt always translate to DEMONSTRATED capability. It can get affected by other traits, and you can compensate any lack of this to some extent by knowledge and experience (repetition).

    2. Conscientiousness / Agency : Again many definitions exist, but the one I use, if I put simply, is the capability to control your actions and emotions instead of getting controlled by them.

    3. Openness : Acceptance to talk/discuss/ponder over radically new ideas, which may or may not be extremely taboo in whatever beliefs you hold.

    4. Preference for truth : The degree to which one is willing to stay within the realm of reality as observed by basic perceptions (sight, sound, taste, touch, smell) and any derivations done from them and them only.

    5. Agreebleness : How necessary it is for the person to be in harmonious agreement with the people around him/her.

    So if I apply those dimensions to the alpha/beta classification made in the video, I guess his alpha is : Low Agreebleness, High Agency and Above average IQ. If any of those three is not fulfilled, then the person is classified as beta.
    Last edited by rkspsm; June 8, 2021 at 11:15 AM.
    Unless stated otherwise, I am NOT presenting my preferences.

    Preferences can be views, thoughts, opinions, philosophies, morals, values, ideology, imaginations, fantasies, fictions, god, soul, spirit...

    I am using scientific method, its an algorithmic computation, designed to give highest efficiency and chance to win in a conflict, at a very high cost of mental discomfort of not adhering to preferences and spending time and energy on the computation.

  9. #9
    Senior Member happybachelor's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Some good points here.

    One point I disagree on - that it's an oversimplification, and this being a reason to dismiss it. This is the no.1 defence women bring out when we're saying AWALT.
    A generalised, simplified understanding is often the basis of knowledge. There may be more to personality type that we've yet to discover, but I believe it's irrefutable that we can say there are broadly type A men and type B personalities (women included). In the same way we recognise alphas in the animal kingdom because they exhibit quite different behaviour (which is observable and repeatable in certain animal groups) to the majority.

    I would say it's definitely more common in pack type animals. If that's true, you can see how the type A then is being slowly bred out of humans as we all become 'individuals'. Living in separate apartments, not knowing your neighbours etc, is likely the goal of the elite. If we're not a 'pack species', the alpha will be no more.

    Another thing to consider is there is your nature, then your behaviour. The two don't always match. Yours truly was an introverted kid, then in his twenties was more the extrovert. If you'd asked anyone who knew me then they'd probably say I was an extrovert. But it was simply acting up, me being the person I thought I needed to be rather than who I really was. Being gregarious, telling stories, drama, always something on the go... entertaining people. Yeah, embarrassing to think of now. But I'm sure it'll ring true for other men.
    Now it's clear as day I'm an introvert, and always was.

    In the same way women often act contrary to their female nature and even personality. We can say that in times past and in some cultures now, they do not so easily expose their nature because it would not be an optimal strategy to do so. "She's a whore, shame on her!" In the West now however they have no such qualms, the message they are getting through media is that it's optimal TO expose their nature. "She's a whore, you go girl!" Ironically they are losing out, but that was the goal of the cabal anyway. Perhaps ironically too, it's enabled men en-masse to wake up to the reality of what women are.

    I guess a conditional belief is whether you think personalities are more or less fixed and that people just act in other ways, OR if everything is changeable. I believe the former to be true.

    This guy really opened my eyes as to male and female psychology. Society has cast me as the disagreeable asshole. I could never make it work with women, I always felt miserable and that was because I knew I couldn't be in charge. I was always fighting with them. But you have to give her the pants. Every man knows this deep down. Now for a type B male this is fine. And this allows civilisation to function. But for me it's not fine. I feel depressed to the point of rage and suicide. And that's cos my nature is being stifled. In the same way, I stifle her nature by not letting her win. She has to be in control. Unless it's a small minority of women who are happier being subordinate or subduing their nature severely.
    For this reason I believe discussion of red and blue pill men is insufficient without knowledge of their personality type. We all like to trash on 'blue pillers' but we do mankind a disservice because these blue pillers are happiest supporting a family and that even helps our own lives by supporting the civilisation around us.
    Last edited by happybachelor; June 8, 2021 at 12:30 PM.
    Alpha male with a warrior spirit.
    Follower of Christ.
    Take the established 'truth' as far as society is concerned and go 180 degrees from that... there you will find the truth. Society is ass-backwards and your job is undoing all that BS you were programmed with your entire life.
    When men choose not to believe in God, they do not thereafter believe in nothing. They then become capable of believing in anything.


  10. #10
    Senior Member rkspsm's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Quote Originally Posted by happybachelor View Post
    One point I disagree on - that it's an oversimplification, and this being a reason to dismiss it. This is the no.1 defence women bring out when we're saying AWALT. A generalised, simplified understanding is often the basis of knowledge.
    When I said his classification is too simplistic, I was mainly focusing on its usability, especially from the Type B perspective. Simplicity is great to build the foundation for the knowledge. Its easier to add to an existing base than to construct the whole thing by the brain. But when you go out to apply it or use it to solve a problem or make a prediction, you need to be atleast somewhat aware of the limits.

    His Type B is too big a majority. And he mentioned early near the start that it is pretty much assigned at birth, and that acting like the other will always be suboptimal. Now that itself is a very simplified view of things and a good solid base. But for a type B man to make any use of it, especially in relationships, he also needs to understand what comes a bit later into the video with bits and pieces scattered here and there. And that is, within type B itself, the dynamics can be, and often is, very different for a tall and good, manly looking type B chad in a limousine vs an average type B joe on the street. After that detail, then I think the concept becomes actually usable for a person. Use as in, to figure out the optimal strategy.

    I am into 55 minutes or so, and now I do see that his Type A can also be furthur broken down. For example, he mentions that Type A needs to be in charge of the things. He may need support and assistance from his woman, and he will EXPECT that, but ultimately he should be the one running the show. Well, there is a spectrum there too. I myself NEED to have an ABSOLUTE control over my immediate/private life. I cannot tolerate any relationship at all because I will then have to give up SOME control of life, regardless of how small it is.

    Anyways, this is one of the best and most straightforward, to the point, in-your-face video I have seen, outside the circles I usually follow. So I plan to watch all of it in bits and pieces. And he is quite accurate too, and which is why he will run into the same problems which anyone runs into if he is trying to do that. And that is, he will need to redefine/refine few words here and there. In the modern culture where anything can mean anything, and anybody believing whatever they want to, its not possible to be accurate without restricting or altering the meanings of few words. The classic word which always comes to my mind is : racism. The irony is, the people who cannot define it, use it all the time, and the people who CAN define it, almost never use it !!
    Unless stated otherwise, I am NOT presenting my preferences.

    Preferences can be views, thoughts, opinions, philosophies, morals, values, ideology, imaginations, fantasies, fictions, god, soul, spirit...

    I am using scientific method, its an algorithmic computation, designed to give highest efficiency and chance to win in a conflict, at a very high cost of mental discomfort of not adhering to preferences and spending time and energy on the computation.

  11. #11
    Senior Member happybachelor's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Quote Originally Posted by rkspsm View Post
    When I said his classification is too simplistic, I was mainly focusing on its usability, especially from the Type B perspective. Simplicity is great to build the foundation for the knowledge. Its easier to add to an existing base than to construct the whole thing by the brain. But when you go out to apply it or use it to solve a problem or make a prediction, you need to be atleast somewhat aware of the limits.

    His Type B is too big a majority. And he mentioned early near the start that it is pretty much assigned at birth, and that acting like the other will always be suboptimal. Now that itself is a very simplified view of things and a good solid base. But for a type B man to make any use of it, especially in relationships, he also needs to understand what comes a bit later into the video with bits and pieces scattered here and there. And that is, within type B itself, the dynamics can be, and often is, very different for a tall and good, manly looking type B chad in a limousine vs an average type B joe on the street. After that detail, then I think the concept becomes actually usable for a person. Use as in, to figure out the optimal strategy.

    I am into 55 minutes or so, and now I do see that his Type A can also be furthur broken down. For example, he mentions that Type A needs to be in charge of the things. He may need support and assistance from his woman, and he will EXPECT that, but ultimately he should be the one running the show. Well, there is a spectrum there too. I myself NEED to have an ABSOLUTE control over my immediate/private life. I cannot tolerate any relationship at all because I will then have to give up SOME control of life, regardless of how small it is.

    Anyways, this is one of the best and most straightforward, to the point, in-your-face video I have seen, outside the circles I usually follow. So I plan to watch all of it in bits and pieces. And he is quite accurate too, and which is why he will run into the same problems which anyone runs into if he is trying to do that. And that is, he will need to redefine/refine few words here and there. In the modern culture where anything can mean anything, and anybody believing whatever they want to, its not possible to be accurate without restricting or altering the meanings of few words. The classic word which always comes to my mind is : racism. The irony is, the people who cannot define it, use it all the time, and the people who CAN define it, almost never use it !!
    I'm glad you like it. You will learn a lot from this guy if you watch his other lectures.

    His Type B is too big a majority. And he mentioned early near the start that it is pretty much assigned at birth, and that acting like the other will always be suboptimal. Now that itself is a very simplified view of things and a good solid base. But for a type B man to make any use of it, especially in relationships, he also needs to understand what comes a bit later into the video with bits and pieces scattered here and there. And that is, within type B itself, the dynamics can be, and often is, very different for a tall and good, manly looking type B chad in a limousine vs an average type B joe on the street. After that detail, then I think the concept becomes actually usable for a person. Use as in, to figure out the optimal strategy.
    For me I like to know the fundamentals of things. That way I can minimise the risk of a faulty diagnosis later on. And of being lied to, led down the garden path. So it is useful for me to start with simple types. So yes I agree, a person needs to watch this entirely to get the picture. It is freestyle but nonetheless it is structured in a progressive way where the pieces come together. I think he's very talented. And funny as well.

    I like how he picks apart the woman's points masterfully, even though clearly the woman is what most would consider to be quite learned on the subject.

    There are so many golden nuggets. Like at 1:45 when he says whenever you listen to a woman talk you must interpret it. You cannot take the words that she utters literally. It's got to be contextual. For you to get the context you have to interpret it, when they say one thing they mean this.
    This explains simply why I felt I could never trust women and got pissed off when they speak. So am I borderline autistic for expecting people to mean what they say? Or do women just cloak what they say in clever words? I think we know.

    I tend to listen to stuff like this while I'm working on the house. That way I don't have to spend 3 hours staring at one person, and actually I am a better listener when I don't have to look as well.
    Alpha male with a warrior spirit.
    Follower of Christ.
    Take the established 'truth' as far as society is concerned and go 180 degrees from that... there you will find the truth. Society is ass-backwards and your job is undoing all that BS you were programmed with your entire life.
    When men choose not to believe in God, they do not thereafter believe in nothing. They then become capable of believing in anything.


  12. #12
    Senior Member rkspsm's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Quote Originally Posted by happybachelor View Post
    We all like to trash on 'blue pillers' but we do mankind a disservice because these blue pillers are happiest supporting a family and that even helps our own lives by supporting the civilisation around us.
    This is very true. The traditional family man in a traditional family is the engine of humanity. We wont be what we are, if we dont get that setup back into its normal working condition. Whether one thinks this is possible or not, is another matter.

    Quote Originally Posted by happybachelor View Post
    I like how he picks apart the woman's points masterfully, even though clearly the woman is what most would consider to be quite learned on the subject.
    Yes, its actually quite rare that one handles this topic correctly with all the nuance. There are people who believe that women as a whole are one giant alien brain conspiring to destroy all the civilization !! Fuck no ! They dont have the brains to get their own lives together, let alone fighting the entire civilization !!

    But when you bring up the issue of manipulation, they think we are saying that some other floating big brain is controlling every single neuron in every woman alive.

    In this video, he talks about manipulation that is SUBTLE. And not only subtle, but quite slow to be noticeable unless you are aware of it already. It has happened over decades if not centuries.

    Quote Originally Posted by happybachelor View Post
    There are so many golden nuggets. Like at 1:45 when he says whenever you listen to a woman talk you must interpret it. You cannot take the words that she utters literally. It's got to be contextual. For you to get the context you have to interpret it, when they say one thing they mean this.
    This explains simply why I felt I could never trust women and got pissed off when they speak. So am I borderline autistic for expecting people to mean what they say? Or do women just cloak what they say in clever words? I think we know.
    By now I am sure you have your own strategies to deal with that situation, that is women saying something and meaning something else. I am writing here one strategy which I followed and it is very nicely mentioned in Art of War book. In there Sun Tzu says that its the aggressor who controls the battle. Where its taking place, when its taking place, and how is it taking place. Now applying it to conversations with women, if you are always the one who is trying to figure out what she is saying, you are on the backfoot, and she is the aggressor. Even if you do figure out correctly, she is still winning.

    The strategy which I am suggesting, and have been using from instinct (even before I read Art of War), is to become the aggressor myself. If I detect that the person I am talking to is trying to play this game, man or woman, I will simply start overriding. I will break the chain of conversation and insert something ridiculous and demanding (the bully mode). I may mock the person, or assert something, or anything of that sort. From this point on, THAT person is on backfoot, now he/she has to figure out where the hell did I come up with that ?! For this strategy to work, you have to find an optimum point, such that whatever you said is piercing enough that the other person feels it, while at the same time not offending enough for that person to call the police or whatever.
    Unless stated otherwise, I am NOT presenting my preferences.

    Preferences can be views, thoughts, opinions, philosophies, morals, values, ideology, imaginations, fantasies, fictions, god, soul, spirit...

    I am using scientific method, its an algorithmic computation, designed to give highest efficiency and chance to win in a conflict, at a very high cost of mental discomfort of not adhering to preferences and spending time and energy on the computation.

  13. #13
    Senior Member mgtower's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Quote Originally Posted by rkspsm View Post
    This is very true. The traditional family man in a traditional family is the engine of humanity. We wont be what we are, if we dont get that setup back into its normal working condition. Whether one thinks this is possible or not, is another matter.



    Yes, its actually quite rare that one handles this topic correctly with all the nuance. There are people who believe that women as a whole are one giant alien brain conspiring to destroy all the civilization !! Fuck no ! They dont have the brains to get their own lives together, let alone fighting the entire civilization !!

    But when you bring up the issue of manipulation, they think we are saying that some other floating big brain is controlling every single neuron in every woman alive.

    In this video, he talks about manipulation that is SUBTLE. And not only subtle, but quite slow to be noticeable unless you are aware of it already. It has happened over decades if not centuries.



    By now I am sure you have your own strategies to deal with that situation, that is women saying something and meaning something else. I am writing here one strategy which I followed and it is very nicely mentioned in Art of War book. In there Sun Tzu says that its the aggressor who controls the battle. Where its taking place, when its taking place, and how is it taking place. Now applying it to conversations with women, if you are always the one who is trying to figure out what she is saying, you are on the backfoot, and she is the aggressor. Even if you do figure out correctly, she is still winning.

    The strategy which I am suggesting, and have been using from instinct (even before I read Art of War), is to become the aggressor myself. If I detect that the person I am talking to is trying to play this game, man or woman, I will simply start overriding. I will break the chain of conversation and insert something ridiculous and demanding (the bully mode). I may mock the person, or assert something, or anything of that sort. From this point on, THAT person is on backfoot, now he/she has to figure out where the hell did I come up with that ?! For this strategy to work, you have to find an optimum point, such that whatever you said is piercing enough that the other person feels it, while at the same time not offending enough for that person to call the police or whatever.
    The big ugly monster isn't from some alien central command, it's all the laws enacted in favor of women without one moment of debate or deliberation on what it will do to men. Look no further than Law and Order to find the big ugly monster that unites women as one and used to destroy us and society at large.

    Jails are REAL!

    Courts are REAL!

    Prisons full of Men, NOT women is the REALITY! WOMEN are NOT held to ACCOUNT!

    The desire to AVOID ALL THREE (court, jail, women) is REAL!

    MGTOW: Living in the REAL world, where REAL monsters, eating REAL MEN do in fact EXIST!
    If government forces an experimental vaccine on you it's citizen, sure as hell's hot, it will assume it has the obligation to make all your medical decisions.

  14. #14
    Senior Member rkspsm's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Quote Originally Posted by mgtower View Post
    The big ugly monster isn't from some alien central command, it's all the laws enacted in favor of women without one moment of debate or deliberation on what it will do to men. Look no further than Law and Order to find the big ugly monster that unites women as one and used to destroy us and society at large.

    Jails are REAL!

    Courts are REAL!

    Prisons full of Men, NOT women is the REALITY! WOMEN are NOT held to ACCOUNT!

    The desire to AVOID ALL THREE (court, jail, women) is REAL!

    MGTOW: Living in the REAL world, where REAL monsters, eating REAL MEN do in fact EXIST!
    And who enacted those laws ? Who will be the one who will use force or even lethal force if you decide to use natural law ? How much percent of military is made up of the sex with testosterone, who takes oath to protect their country from all the threats, domestic and foreign, and yet willing to put themselves in danger and DIE for the very same people who made these laws ?

    I am sorry, I see all these men, who are armed and capable to fight who are being stupid enough to fall for this trap MORE responsible for the situation we are in than anything else. After that will come the men who are enacting these laws. After that will come the woman.

    Predator and prey. The prey cannot complain that predator is hunting them. It must stop being a prey.

    How many men, who complained about child support or alimony or whatever, actually told the police to come and get some ?? No they didnt. They CHOSE, by their own FREE WILL, to submit and in the process embolden and empower, the evil, the satan, the cabal, the monsters, or whatever else you want to call it.

    I have absolutely no sympathy for the weak and the stupid, and never will have. Without them, the "evil" has no power to do anything, nobody will listen to them. Without weak and the stupid men, women have no power. Source: all of history.
    Unless stated otherwise, I am NOT presenting my preferences.

    Preferences can be views, thoughts, opinions, philosophies, morals, values, ideology, imaginations, fantasies, fictions, god, soul, spirit...

    I am using scientific method, its an algorithmic computation, designed to give highest efficiency and chance to win in a conflict, at a very high cost of mental discomfort of not adhering to preferences and spending time and energy on the computation.

  15. #15
    Senior Member happybachelor's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    By now I am sure you have your own strategies to deal with that situation, that is women saying something and meaning something else. I am writing here one strategy which I followed and it is very nicely mentioned in Art of War book. In there Sun Tzu says that its the aggressor who controls the battle. Where its taking place, when its taking place, and how is it taking place. Now applying it to conversations with women, if you are always the one who is trying to figure out what she is saying, you are on the backfoot, and she is the aggressor. Even if you do figure out correctly, she is still winning.
    The strategy which I am suggesting, and have been using from instinct (even before I read Art of War), is to become the aggressor myself. If I detect that the person I am talking to is trying to play this game, man or woman, I will simply start overriding. I will break the chain of conversation and insert something ridiculous and demanding (the bully mode). I may mock the person, or assert something, or anything of that sort. From this point on, THAT person is on backfoot, now he/she has to figure out where the hell did I come up with that ?! For this strategy to work, you have to find an optimum point, such that whatever you said is piercing enough that the other person feels it, while at the same time not offending enough for that person to call the police or whatever.


    Fascinating stuff! Attack is often a good defence.

    As Sun Tzu said himself, the supreme art of war is to subdue your enemy without even fighting. Something to think about.

    Alpha male with a warrior spirit.
    Follower of Christ.
    Take the established 'truth' as far as society is concerned and go 180 degrees from that... there you will find the truth. Society is ass-backwards and your job is undoing all that BS you were programmed with your entire life.
    When men choose not to believe in God, they do not thereafter believe in nothing. They then become capable of believing in anything.


  16. #16
    Super Moderator Mr Wombat's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    As Alex explains, the ultimate catch for a woman is the Type B personality type with the attractive look,
    Aka, a "toyboy".

  17. #17
    Super Moderator Mr Wombat's Avatar
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    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    An alpha male is a man whom other men follow. This is what so much of the manosphere gets wrong: it isn't women that define alpha, it's men.

  18. #18

    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    An alpha is also supposed to watch over and care for the tribe/pack. He's not just a violent thug/bully.

  19. #19

    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Wombat View Post
    An alpha male is a man whom other men follow. This is what so much of the manosphere gets wrong: it isn't women that define alpha, it's men.
    The whole standard being based on how women perceive or interact with the man, is my whole basis for regarding it as a product of the sick times that produced it. It is based in fantasy not reality . A woman's estimate of a man is based on his utility plain and simple; this has nothing to do with how he's able to get to that position.


    I think in the end no one can objectively view the world, as by virtue of interest in a situation, we are inherently biased towards one position or another . Not to say the alternative positions have no merits but we choose our own yardstick and determine their worth measured against that. The position we choose might even be the most rational amongst the selected under scrutiny but it doesn't necessarily mean it's the best option ever .


    So even while trying to be objective, we can still fall prey to subjectivist bias.A man who has an interest in a monogamous relationship with women, is bound to have that affect his estimation of things, regardless how much he tries to claim otherwise. For we don't see things as they are, but as we are.

    Hence why he can't accept that mgtow would rather not sleep on the streets or even own houses as a financially more pragmatic position than rent. In his estimation it must be because they want pussy, see the point ?!


    Every aspect of his psyche interpretes life as a pursuit of sex, so how can he understand anything outside that context when by his own standards, that is the goal of life ?
    Cheers

  20. #20

    Re: What makes an alpha male?

    Quote Originally Posted by rkspsm View Post
    Yes, what you were trying to say from disney and RomCom era is the same as what I said about times of comfort, abundance of resources. The perception of reality is a twisted one because no abundance ever lasts. The humans, like any other animal, tend to out reproduce any excess and we go back to the crisis. So the error which needs to be corrected, and it will be corrected eventually, is that those "save the damsel in distress" minded men will realized that the crisis is real, and there is (or will be) no way to save the princesses.



    Agreed that its too simplistic. This was also my point that the way he classified, one side is very small and other too big to be of any use to them. But regardless of the simplicity, he still defined it quite clearly and from what I have watched stayed with his definition. I am fine with that. If you need to redefine some terms to convey your meaning, and as long as you dont stray too far from their assumed meaning, its good. This is why I used the phrases like "Alpha, according to HIS classification" and "Beta, according to HIS classification".

    The second thing I'd say, that in any sort of classification, there will be some "inferior" groups. And there will be people who will be categorized into that group, regardless of how they feel about it. In his classification the beta is inferior in some regards, and most of the people are beta with that definition. It is what it is. Feeling bad about it, instead of challenging any consistency of his classification, is simply more evidence to the very point he makes : Alpha: Conflict, Beta: Feelz.

    I know many other classifications, the one I like the most is these :

    1. IQ : Your natural intellectual "horsepower". The higher it is, the more subtle patterns you can identify and then use them to predict things and solve more problems. This is fixed from birth and doesnt change much. But do note that this doesnt always translate to DEMONSTRATED capability. It can get affected by other traits, and you can compensate any lack of this to some extent by knowledge and experience (repetition).

    2. Conscientiousness / Agency : Again many definitions exist, but the one I use, if I put simply, is the capability to control your actions and emotions instead of getting controlled by them.

    3. Openness : Acceptance to talk/discuss/ponder over radically new ideas, which may or may not be extremely taboo in whatever beliefs you hold.

    4. Preference for truth : The degree to which one is willing to stay within the realm of reality as observed by basic perceptions (sight, sound, taste, touch, smell) and any derivations done from them and them only.

    5. Agreebleness : How necessary it is for the person to be in harmonious agreement with the people around him/her.

    So if I apply those dimensions to the alpha/beta classification made in the video, I guess his alpha is : Low Agreebleness, High Agency and Above average IQ. If any of those three is not fulfilled, then the person is classified as beta.
    I prefer this classification but my major grouse was that every mention of alpha inherently tends to view things from the perspective of what women find attractive.

    The truth is, those traits if decoupled from sexuality, can be found in men in every domain. From academia to the military and yet he might still be considered beta by his wife, even if he's an alpha soldier with the medals to prove it.The whole standard being based on how women perceive or interact with the men, is my whole basis for regarding it as a product of the sick times that produced it. It is based in fantasy not reality . A woman's estimate of a man is based on his utility plain and simple; this has nothing to do with how he's able to get to that position.


    I think I prefer Jordan Petersons explanation of alpha. Dominance heirarchies he called them, not of power per se but of competence. Looking that it that way, you see that except you want to specifically use interaction with women as a yardstick, thee are a lot of alphas in different domains. Most times people conserve mental energy to pursue things they regard as of paramount importance, while being mediocre in other domains. That's the cost of civilisation. No one in his right mind would ask the buff, decorated military veteran for ideas on curbing a pandemic but neither would you want the research scientist on the battle field, we seem to hae forgotten this distinction as a specie.

    Cheers


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