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  1. #1

    My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    A warning - this is a long, long read.

    Relationship History: While the other boys were going on "dates" and hanging out with girls in groups and then alone with those girls in middle school, I would watch and wonder what was wrong with me, because I wasn't dating, no one seemed interested in even talking to me in a friendly way. I have a cousin who is the same age as me and he went to a different school in the same district. I had one close friend who abandoned me when he started dating a girl in October of our 7th grade year - that relationship was over/gone/non-existent by April of 7th grade year and we patched things up going into 8th grade. I ended up joining the football team because I thought it was mandatory, based on a single sentence the new head coach said. I had never played football, it wasn't watched in my house, and I knew nothing about the game, the rules, what the different positions did - nothing. And yet it was after those games that girls started talking to me. A few girls would give me their phone numbers, asking me to call them.

    Because I had limited experience with this world, I would call a single girl repeatedly through the afternoon and evening until I could get her on the line but that act would freak them out and they'd back off. I ended up switching school districts and middle schools shortly after football season was over my 8th grade year and at my new school not only was I not a part of the in-crowd, I wasn't a part of any crowd. I was an outsider with no real friends. Everyone already had their established groups and I never did seem to fit in with anyone so I got quiet and largely kept to myself.

    The following year was my first year of high school with all these people - and remembering back from the Spring of 8th grade - the way people talked, many of them already knew a lot of folks in high school, either because of prior interaction at the middle school level or because of older brothers/sisters/cousins that were there. That was also intimidating.

    Not only had I failed to make any meaningful connections in the few short months I was at my new middle school, I was heading off to yet another school with people who were 18 years old.

    I don't remember much about my 9th grade year. My mom told me that at Christmas break, I had come home and was depressed because I wasn't making connections with anyone. I legitimately don't remember that but don't have any reason to doubt it. It was the Spring Semester of 2000 that I took a class with a lot of upper classmen, most of which were seniors taking a blow-off class to pad out the afternoon. Many of them didn't like me off the bat because other freshmen had acted like complete idiots at parties these guys had thrown - and even though I didn't recognize the names they were throwing out - I was guilty by association, the association being we were in the same grade.

    There was a girl in the class, a senior, who started making advances toward me. Looking back I realize how really inappropriate and even predatory it was, but I thought I was cool because I went from not having much in the way of friends or connections to my high school to dating a senior, and after all, she could drive! Wow! I got invited to prom, experienced my first sexual activity, she graduated and I realized that I had three years of high school ahead of me and didn't want to be tied to someone that didn't seem to be going anywhere. She was content to stay at her minimum wage retail job, take a single class at Tarrant County Community College, but kept talking about waiting for me to graduate so we could have a family.

    Thinking back - my parents should have stepped in and said no to her. She had a lot of problems and I think she was craving stability. She lived with a family that were members of her church, her mother lived down in south Fort Worth somewhere, I don't know if she ever knew her dad, her mother would date guys that would molest her and give her drugs...none of these things were her fault and she was really doing the best she could with what she had but why my parents let me date her, I don't know...maybe they thought it wouldn't have been right to deprive me of the experience after me not having normal social interactions...I don't know.

    By June or July of 2000, I had reached my wits end with her. She was becoming possessive while pressuring me for sex and I just didn't want to have to deal with it anymore, so I told her I was done. I'll never forget that night, she stood in the middle of the street in front of my house and bent down to the ground, yelled "No!", wept bitterly, and hung out there talking about ending her life. I eventually went into the house, realizing there wasn't anything I could do or wanted to do with her. That was relationship number 1.

    Entering into my sophomore year, things just took off. I started dating casually, and dating girls I thought were out of my league. I enjoyed myself, dating a lot of good looking gals that were socially plugged in. I dated my way through a good chunk of the cheerleading squad and ended with one that I stayed with from Christmas of junior year until right after graduation in June of 2003. We went our separate ways and I tried to re-connect with her but she was having none of it. Last I heard she was dating a guy from her work, became pregnant, the guy refused to acknowledge it was his, and it caused a lot of problems for her - her son will be 14 in a few months, which is hard to fathom, as I feel like I barely left college. That was relationship 2.

    I felt lost after high school. I had lived the previous x number of years being told what to do, where to be, what time to be there, what to study, and using it as the place where I gained friendships. Socially, I felt like I had blossomed the last two years of high school, where previously I had had nothing and been awkward and goofy in an annoying way. And just like that, it was done. No more football games, no more tryouts, no more social clubs, no more plays, it was over. That was a dark time for me, looking back on it now. I remember my 19th birthday. I was working a dead-end job in a warehouse at a medical equipment supplier, and just felt like I would never be anybody or anything. I remember my mom telling me there wasn't any money for presents or eating out or cake that year because of severe mismanagement - she didn't tell me the mismanagement part, I learned/found that out later. I didn't know anything about college or how to pay for it. No one had ever talked to me about financial aid and I didn't even know the right questions to ask, so I sat out from school between June of 2003 and didn't go back until Spring 2004 - which is no time at all but for me, at that time, it might as well have been an eternity.

    The day I walked out of the Tarrant County Convention center for graduation was really the last time I talked to anyone from high school. Those relationships were shallow and it takes me a long time to establish a connection with people and so I was essentially floating through the time period between high school and college aimless and without friends. I think that time period had a profound, negative effect on me that I deal with the effects of to this day.

    I ended up registering for class at the University of North Texas, and was so excited when I got accepted. I felt I had really accomplished something and was excited at the possibilities it presented. Finally, I thought, things could go back to the way they used to be, just in a different setting. I ended up taking two classes - a sociology class I never attended, and a history class I really enjoyed. I remember spending hours each day up there that semester, trying to find a way to fit in, and to belong, to get back that sense of belonging. I investigated joining UNT's spirit organization that performed during football games, was at the gym a lot, spent a lot of time in the library reading, and hung around campus hoping that someone would talk to me. One day I was sitting in the on-campus book store, late on a Friday afternoon, reading and looked over to find an attractive Latin gal waving excitedly at me. I thought it was odd and had no clue who she was, so I awkwardly waved back and thought nothing more of it. I went home and had received a text from a number I didn't recognize saying "Can't believe you didn't recognize me! It was great seeing you. Sorry I didn't say hi, I was on a tour with my mom".

    I still had no clue who it was. Didn't have the number saved, and there was no context to the author, but whoever she was, she had my number and had clearly recognized me from the UNT bookstore. Even though Google was in its infancy, I was able to plug in the phone number to see who it was. Maria, a senior from my high school that I had met at a party prior to my graduation the previous year. Apparently I had made a huge impression on her without realizing it. I texted her back and told her that I apologized for being out of it and not recognizing her - she was ok and suggested that we meet up.

    For some reason - to this day I couldn't tell you why - I never contacted her.

    My first, and what would turn out to be only, semester at UNT was coming to a close. One day I was walking to class and noticed a flyer on a trashcan advertising for a Christian summer camp based around sports. I noted when the on-campus interviews would be happening and decided to take a chance and apply. I met with the director and heard back a few weeks later that I had been hired. I was very excited about it and felt it was a chance to get away from my parents and maybe get some perspective without having to take an expensive vacation or live on-campus at UNT and incur that expense.

    I packed my things and headed down to the camp, a three and a half hour drive away. I settled in and very quickly became established with a zany group of friends. We were essentially performing all the time and there were some real characters down there that I thoroughly enjoyed. What was unique about this experience is that while the typical "fall in love for the summer" romances were occurring between male and female counselors, I found that I was perfectly content to not get involved with women. I think one or two may have made an earnest attempt to get to know me, but I kept the women at arms length while I was there and didn't seem to suffer any adverse consequences because of it. And that moment really opened my eyes because it let me know that the energy I had been putting into "looking and smelling good, developing my personality, and becoming the kind of man a woman would want" could be put into other activities.

    And I started asking, if I could put that energy into other activities, positive and beneficial activities, where could I go?

    Fast Forward to Spring of 2005 and I decide in a desperate move to go away to college in another state. Things were falling apart and were really bizarre at home and in the confusion and constant noise coming from my mother, I felt like I needed to get away - a decision I am still paying for to this day.

    But it was here at a college that jokingly markets itself as a "Ring by Spring" accredited institution, that some things were really solidified for me. I had danced with the concepts earlier but it was at this University that I drew hard lines in the sand for myself, though it took place over 4.5 years.

    I dated two girls here, had crushes on a whole lot more, and made friends with a few. Just like with high school, I am no longer in contact with anyone I went to school with here and have a hard time remembering the full names of people that I spent significant time with, that's how little I think about this place.

    Of the two relationships I had here, I'll only discuss one - the last one. In some ways, it really was the last relationship I ever had, in that I have not had a relationship as normal as the one I had with her since.

    Her name was Elise and she came from a large family. I worked really hard (my biggest problem) to win her over and get her to date me or take me seriously. We had started out as friends. She recognized me for some reason at a play tryout I went to in the Fall of 2007, even though I don't know that we had had any interaction before then. I may have seen her at a party the previous Spring, but would be hard pressed to say that we had had any conversations or interactions during. Anyway, she ran in the same circles I did, and over time I developed a crush on her, which really hit its stride in the Fall of 2008. That's when I made a play for her and by Spring 2009, we were dating.

    She was another mess with strange ideas about becoming famous, moving to Hollywood and becoming an actress, moving to Kentucky and becoming a successful theater actor (I didn't know that is where you went for that, but whatever), and striking out to have a rental home empire in her home town (which is also where our university was located). In other words, she was all over the map. What was interesting about the dynamic between her and me is that the relationship started with me being far more interested in her than she was in me, and by the time the thing had run its course, she was way more interested in me than I was her.

    We had spent significant time with each other, alone, from September until October. I worked at a radio station at the time and we had talked about hanging out after my shift. I remember sending her a text and not hearing back from her. I fell asleep and woke up around 11:30 that night, only to discover she had not responded. While we weren't official by that point, I could only assume she knew I liked her. I had the impression she liked me too, given how much time she spent with me alone, and with that in mind, I loaded up in my 4Runner and went driving. It was a cold night, misty, with a light fog. I rode around the streets, looking to see if I could spot her maroon Ford Expedition and eventually did, at her ex-boyfriend's house. I'll never forget the disappointment I felt when I saw that SUV parked out there, the lights in the house off.

    They had been one of those couples that had dated for years and were in the death knell of the relationship when I first encountered her. It was widely known knowledge that her boyfriend cheated on her every chance he got and yet somehow, she was unaware of this. She also acted like it was completely normal for her to go every weekend without ever seeing him, even after he got off his shift at Starbucks. Given how much time she would spend with me and groups of people during the week and weekend, it seemed like the only person that didn't realize she wasn't in a relationship with this guy was Elise.

    Elise and her boyfriend, Barista Mark, had broken up at the beginning of the 2008-2009 school year, so to see her car parked out front, so late at night, was really bothersome. I knew what it meant. Angry and hurt, I kept driving around and interestingly enough, passed her car as she was making her way back to her parents' house around 1:00 that morning. I knew she had seen and recognized my car, even through the misty fog, because I had determined to stop talking to her after that, and as soon as I got back to my apartment, there was a message from Elise's younger sister in my Facebook chat. We were headed into a week long Fall break, and Elise and I had made plans to hang out for most of it, but with her kicking the week off like that, I thought why bother?

    I thought it was strange that Elise's youngest sister, a middle school student at the time, was messaging me at 1:00 AM to see what I was up to...I ignored it, but against my eternal better judgment, didn't ignore it forever. As it turned out, Elise had prompted her to talk to me as a proxy to figure out what I had seen, where I had been that night, what I had been up to...

    I eventually broke down and Elise and I spent the Spring of 2009 dating. This continued on into the Summer, but on September 1st, 2009, I had an awesome and spectacular car accident, in which my nose was almost completely cut from my face, my right femur snapped into two, and I broke my wrist. That accident changed a lot of things for me, including my perspective on the transient nature of the reality we find ourselves in, and it also started my full blown love affair with the last white, oblong tablet I would ever need - M523, a pill that quite honestly has opened my eyes.

    I had been wanting to end things with Elise starting in late Summer, before the accident, but was too chickenpoo to pull the trigger. The accident gave me an excuse to stay away from her and I secretly hoped she would give me a reason to leave - either because she was cheating or because she needed someone who was more present - but alas, she gave me no easy way out. The more distant I tried to be, the less I wanted to see her, the less I would contact her, it seemed like she dug her heels in. She would show up at my apartment in these hysterical fits, she would start fights with me, she would drink a single beer and then come over in a rage and try and provoke me to who knows what. Meanwhile, my own financial situation was deteriorating. My roommate decided they were tired of paying rent and left to go back home. I was completely cut off from the university I had originally went out there to attend.

    I was making 7.25 an hour working for Target, trying to heal from my accident while working as many hours as they'd allow me to pick up in order to be able to make it financially. My student loans were starting to come due because I had been out of school longer than 6 months, I had a car payment (where I hadn't had one for several years prior) because I had totaled the last one in my accident, and I was out there trying to make it all work. The last thing I needed was her causing me problems, and at that point, that was all she was good for. Leaving to head back home was the best option - I knew she wasn't ambitious enough to follow me and try to make it on her own like I had tried in her home territory, so I packed up my things and headed back to Texas, thankful to be rid of that 4 year odyssey.

    Elise wasn't done with me yet though. She texted me and said we needed to talk. She had a list of conditions if I was to continue to date her:
    1. I needed to formally ask her father for permission to date her, letting him know that I had every intention of asking for her hand in marriage, and that this exercise was not merely in a vain attempt to obtain the milk without buying the cow
    2. She wanted guarantees that we would be making real strides toward marriage and that I would do my best to make that a reality for the two of us within a year
    3. She wanted guarantees that I would make a child with her once we got married and in her words which I still could vomit at the thought of to this day wrote "I want to create a little life with you"
    4. She then wanted to know what I thought about her coming out to see me that summer, I told her I was all for it, even though that's the last thing I wanted
    5. She said she was looking at putting in a transfer with Starbucks to be moved out to Dallas...I thought that was utterly ridiculous

    I told her I was for everything except number 3. She said "wow, so you're really willing to lose me over a child". I said "I guess so"

    As it would turn out, I believe this was all a tactic to try and get me to be the one to leave. I think she was in love with the idea of painting herself as the victim with whoever would listen - she had done the same with me when speaking of her previous boyfriend. I don't quite know when it happened, but she had at the very least met a guy who was attracted to her, and I think she knew I would never agree to any of those conditions. We continued to talk for another 4 or 5 months, and we met each other in Little Rock (which was roughly half way between where we both lived) in October of 2010. It was a single day visit and she was picking at me for every little thing, something that had never happened before. I knew then it was over but neither of us had the guts to say it. I believe she was doing to the new guy what she had done to me two years prior - going to pay the old guy one last sexual visit before fully committing herself to the new guy.

    After I returned home from that trip I texted her that I was done and she said she understood. She was married less than 6 months later to someone that had attended our university. That was relationship 4.

    It would be 2015 before I would hang out with a woman one on one again. That went nowhere and I successfully dodged her efforts to try and get me to her dad's house alone.

    It would be 2018 before I would go over to a woman's apartment alone and make out with her. The nonsense she pulled reminded me all over again why I didn't pursue relationships or dating or marriage or hanging out or whatever people do these days.

    There was a lone gal in 2019 that I went out to eat with twice. Funnily enough, Valentine's Day was the last time we spent time together and the night ended in tears (for her) when she found out I was not a virgin. Boy, I sure do have a way with the ladies.

    And here we are, on the verge of 2020, a new decade, a new year, and the chance to succeed permanently.

    Awareness: I guess I don't know enough about what Blue Pill means exactly - I have a vague notion, but as far as experiences that would have pushed me toward my current lifestyle...I've just seen enough from women over the years that there is nothing about who they are or how they present themselves that I see as being remotely beneficial in the long run or even anything I really want to expend energy putting up with.

    There's this one woman at my work that drives me up a wall - she's 61, fit for her age, but 61 no less. And I'll be in the middle of working, and the work I do requires a great deal of thought and concentration from me, I can't just sit down and burn through it, I have to wrestle with the tasks I have in order to accomplish what I need to - and she'll just sit down on my desk and start talking like I've got nothing to do but chat. And this is with headphones in.

    And if I say anything like, "J, I'm busy right now. I don't have time to talk," its met with her going to the next cube and gossiping about me to whoever because I didn't give her the attention she thinks she deserves.

    And to me, that really sums up a lot of women that I interact with that are in their late 30's and older - married or single. I have this one woman who has just recently started bothering me to the point I had to leave work because I wasn't getting anything accomplished there with her stopping by every 35 minutes or so to tell me another story about who knows what.

    One of the lessons I've learned about women over the last two years or so is this:

    If I find them attractive, then a lot of other guys have found them attractive and by this stage, they usually know they are attractive too. As such, they don't tend to have any personality because they've never had to develop one. And people without personalities are pretty difficult for me to stomach - there's nothing worse than trying to engage the human equivalent of a brick wall.

    The problem for me is if I don't find them somewhat physically attractive, I don't have much incentive to engage - and yes, that's shallow, but unfortunately that is where I am in life, and then when I am forced to interact with them - whether because of work duties or whatever comes up in the course of a day - if this is someone I see on a semi-regular basis, they end up coming around more or hanging around my desk, or finding excuses to stop by. I didn't understand it at first until a co-worker pointed out a possible theory: "Because you're not worried about making a good impression or performing for the ones you don't find attractive, you come off as confident and good-natured, and women find that attractive. The issue is that the women who find it attractive in you are not the ones you find attractive."

    But even beyond the whole relationship/dating/friendship/marriage/etc, I find the power dynamic of couples to be something I don't want to engage in.

    Just today, I had gone to a wood-working specialty store with my father, and there was a fellow there with his wife and two young girls. The husband and wife were probably around my agemaybe a little younger (early to mid 30s) but I heard her go up to him and say Weve been here almost an hour, Im taking the girls to the park and you can call me when youre ready.
    She didnt have an attitude when she said it but the husbands reaction told me everything I needed to know.
    Im sorry! Im sorry. Sorry. Sorry. He was a big guy, easily standing 63, fit, and yet he adopted the high pitched voice of someone showing submission to authority. His wife was my height 57 and yet that is where the power lie. I thought to myself Youre not missing anything.
    Its just one of countless types of incidents that cause me to feel like Im never going to find anyone I enjoy being around as much as myself.

    Who am I: Thats a tough one because I dont even have that much in the way of identifiable hobbies. At least not in a form most people would recognize. I enjoy music really enjoy music and a wide variety and degree of it, though I have my go tos. I also enjoy automobiles. It seems a fair number of us do, and thats pretty cool to me. If you were to ask me what my ideal holiday was, Id tell you its getting in my car, being able to listen to whatever I wanted, and driving until traffic thinned out. That may sound silly, but I love driving around while listening to music. I cant think of much else I enjoy. Sure, I enjoy reading, I enjoy exploring my own mind, I enjoy tinkering with my computer (machine learning, data science, that sort of thing) but Im a pretty simple fellow. I dont have much in the way of friends, but that is because I enjoy being left alone to think. I enjoy quiet. I like peace, and a good, traffic free road deep on a week night.
    Beyond that, Im glad to be here and Im excited to be a part of this community.

  2. #2
    Administrator Unboxxed's Avatar
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    Re: My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    Wow, drwinkumdice, that was a very interesting read. So often, it's like pulling teeth to get some newbies to talk. LOL. I really appreciate your detailed candor and I bet other members will here as well, once they read your Intro.

    I was reading along and recognizing myself in places until I had to look up what M523 meant, and then I got worried that your story would be about a monkey on your back, but then you said nothing more about it so I kept with the story.

    I enjoyed your observation about the tall, submitting husband. Yeah, I, too, see those things around me that make me appreciate what I don't have.

    A very open and honest Intro. Thank you for taking the time to write it.

    And... welcome!
    The two most important days in your life are the day you were born and the day you find out why. - Mark Twain

    The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation.
    - Henry David Thoreau

    There are 10 types of people in the world - those who understand binary, and those who don't.

    Suitable for bookmarking: www.fakehatecrimes.org and www.breitbart.com/tag/hate-crime-hoax and register-her.net

  3. #3
    Senior Member mgtower's Avatar
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    Re: My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    Great intro!

    Here's my story regarding women, dating, and the entire cabal since 1997 to this day.

    Chapter 1. ------

    THE END

    Welcome!

  4. #4
    Senior Member Hoppes#9's Avatar
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    Re: My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    very nice intro.... and welcome !

  5. #5
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    Re: My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    A Novella if you will - Welcome

  6. #6
    Senior Member Resdayn's Avatar
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    Re: My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    Great intro, welcome buddy!
    Lord Nerevar Reborn

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    Re: My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    And another welcome.
    "Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

    All we can do is keep ourselves from all those who don't deserve it. Dave Matthes

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    Re: My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    Your lucky it didn't all go away when you hit enter. Welcome.
    Every day I make the world a little bit worse.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Opaque's Avatar
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    Re: My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    Interesting intro which doesn't actually address MGTOW from anything conceptual and ideological. You have yet to mention MGTOW, Hypergamy, female manipulation, gynocentrism etc. It seems you have arrived at MGTOW purely through personal experience and realisation, which is refreshing but also unusual on this forum.

    Thoroughly enjoyed the read, and I shall extent my welcome too.

    Regarding one point you made:

    Thinking back - my parents should have stepped in and said no to her. She had a lot of problems and I think she was craving stability. She lived with a family that were members of her church, her mother lived down in south Fort Worth somewhere, I don't know if she ever knew her dad, her mother would date guys that would molest her and give her drugs...none of these things were her fault and she was really doing the best she could with what she had but why my parents let me date her, I don't know...maybe they thought it wouldn't have been right to deprive me of the experience after me not having normal social interactions...I don't know.
    I have a pet theory that mother's wilfully withhold certain life lessons from their sons in order that their sons sacrifice themselves for the gynocracy.

    It was the same for me. My mother (and father too) could have stepped in to help. Mother being more aware of female manipulation would have better insight so only fair to put more blame on her. But I had to learn things the hard way, thankfully without some bitch to be married to or some offspring which I have support all on my own.
    A mother cannot raise a boy to be a man, not because he needs a father figure; but because she favours team vagina over her own son.

    Tradcon women are the most manipulative of all kinds of women, because they infect you with false hope.
    Radfems are your best friend, because they hate you and verbalise it - that's honesty!

    The red pill rage is a process which takes many many years - so be kind and patient with yourself.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Eddie Willers's Avatar
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    Re: My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    Good intro - thanks for the paragraph/line breaks; would have been a Wall to rival the one in China.
    A gun-toting, weed-smoking, gray-bearded redneck with a Masters - old and dangerous.

  11. #11

    Re: My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    I want to thank all of you for the warm welcome. Beyond that, I want to thank you all for having read through the entire thing! I re-read it just now and its a bit rambling, I could have done better to have organized it thematically or by relationship and kept to a coherent, chronological timeline. I'm excited to see such a vibrant community of men who have decided to do their own thing, no matter the reason.

    I'd like to address some of the points raised one by one, since you all took the time to write them and I found them interesting:

    Unboxxed said:
    I was reading along and recognizing myself in places until I had to look up what M523 meant, and then I got worried that your story would be about a monkey on your back, but then you said nothing more about it so I kept with the story.
    My response: I don't think I realized how severe the strain of the day to day was having on me until I took my first one after the accident. I felt so light in my mind. I had never relaxed like that before or to that degree and with the extra computing power, so to speak, I started really thinking through what Elise (the girl I was dating at the time) was doing to me, but then was able to expand that to what all women had done to me. I think all drugs get a bad rap because of the percentage who abuse. We always hear the most extreme stories and cases. No one is ever going to write/film/sing/glamorize the tale of the person who kept their use (of any substance, it doesn't have to be opiates or stimulants or alcohol) regulated and lived a productive, completely regular life. What I found with that pill at that time was that it was taking the ever present thoughts of "how am I going to pay this bill? I'm going to lose X possession. Can I eat today or should I skip it to use toward keeping the heat on?" and flushed the severity I had attached to each concern right down the toilet. It also made me realize I didn't have to live with the constant burden of fear.

    So, that being said, as I thought about what Elise was doing to me emotionally and mentally and in some ways physically, I realized I wasn't responsible for her or her feelings or her attitude or her hang-ups or whatever else she had going on. I didn't have to be her ticket away from her family or her ticket out of her home town or her ticket to LA. I finally had the freedom of thought to pursue a world where I didn't marry or have children or carry the weight of titles like Father or Husband or Employee. And with that revelation, I laid it all down and never looked back. I don't know if I would have gotten there without the freeing cognitive space that I attribute to M523. I drink on occasion and alcohol never relaxed my mind like that. I have taken valium once and fell asleep not long after but it certainly didn't free me of any mental blocks. I don't want to glamorize it, especially if there are men on this board that have struggled or are still struggling with substance abuse, but for me, at that time, it opened up a channel of possibilities I had been too burdened to see.

    @mgtower - I snorted when I read that and was thankful I hadn't just swallowed something to drink!

    Frog said:
    Your lucky it didn't all go away when you hit enter. Welcome.
    My response: I actually became really paranoid and started copying and pasting into a Word doc, saving constantly, then just decided to type it up there then copy it over into the forum for that very reason.

    Opaque said:
    Interesting intro which doesn't actually address MGTOW from anything conceptual and ideological. You have yet to mention MGTOW, Hypergamy, female manipulation, gynocentrism etc. It seems you have arrived at MGTOW purely through personal experience and realisation, which is refreshing but also unusual on this forum.
    My response: I hadn’t even thought about that – I think in some ways I’m not familiar enough with MGTOW to even speak intelligently to the nuances of thought here. I tend to approach personal issues from an uncommon standpoint and others have told me so before, not about MGTOW, but other things, like how I structure my commute, when and where I decide to eat, what I choose to do for personal entertainment, etc. – I don’t know if that is the result of an unconventional upbringing, if I’m eccentric, was poorly socialized…but I will say that I’m glad I didn’t come in through the front door. Please know that as I go forward in posting – If I type something that comes off as offensive or bizarre, I promise it isn’t trolling, I may just see things differently. I’ll do my best to explain my standpoint but I also want to keep an open mind and learn from you all – who you are as men, your stories, what drives you, and what motivates you to be better each day as a man.

    Opaque
    said:
    I have a pet theory that mother's wilfully withhold certain life lessons from their sons in order that their sons sacrifice themselves for the gynocracy.

    It was the same for me. My mother (and father too) could have stepped in to help. Mother being more aware of female manipulation would have better insight so only fair to put more blame on her. But I had to learn things the hard way, thankfully without some bitch to be married to or some offspring which I have support all on my own.
    My response: I’d like to hear more about that and see what direction you take that thought in (regarding the gynocracy sacrifice). Its that sort of thing that I’m nave about and would like to become more educated in. I don’t want to fall victim to feminine manipulation. I feel like I do to an extent at work or other places where I have to interact with women and so far my strategy has been isolation/avoidance which works to a point but its not a great long-term strategy as it can’t be implemented 100%. I need to expand my coping mechanisms and part of that is acquainting myself with different schools of thought and theories. I’m thankful you got out unscathed as well without an 18 year to life commitment. I’ve got a cousin who is in his early 40s. He was my idol for a time during my childhood because he was the oldest of us and we were a tight knit group of cousins. He was the first to get married, first to buy a house, and so on. Anyway, his wife up and left him for a woman, shortly after he and his wife, my aunt and uncle bought a very large house for the four of them.

    I saw him Christmas Eve and we talked. He talked about having to give half of his retirement away to his ex-wife, and he said that he was looking at stable Latin American countries that are English-speaking tourist destinations where the dollar is used as potential retirement spots once his only child turns 18. I thought to myself “so much for that gigantic house you fought so hard to get, so much for all your material possessions and braggart attitude about your ‘hot’ wife…what did it get you man?”

    Not that there is anything wrong with a giant house or the newest car or even attractive women, but they aren’t the sum total of our existence here and the pursuit of these things at the expense of everything else, to me, is a foolish bet. I say all of that to say this again – I’m glad you aren’t burdened with an ex-wife or child either.

    @Eddie Willers - Oh, one of the things that irks me the most is poor formatting and poor spelling/grammar. It can kill what would otherwise be a really great read. I promise to do my best not to post anything like that.

  12. #12
    Senior Member mgtower's Avatar
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    Re: My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    Don't worry, dr, I learned the Heimlich maneuver so I can resuscitate those that are eating when I'm speaking, I can even make a cunt fart! (true story)

  13. #13
    Senior Member Opaque's Avatar
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    Re: My Long Intro: Relationships/B-Pill/Interests

    I’d like to hear more about that and see what direction you take that thought in (regarding the gynocracy sacrifice). Its that sort of thing that I’m nave about and would like to become more educated in. I don’t want to fall victim to feminine manipulation. I feel like I do to an extent at work or other places where I have to interact with women and so far my strategy has been isolation/avoidance which works to a point but its not a great long-term strategy as it can’t be implemented 100%. I need to expand my coping mechanisms and part of that is acquainting myself with different schools of thought and theories.

    You will certainly benefit from checking into this forum regularly so the fellow gentlemen can support you with advice, wisdom and life experience.

    I encourage first and foremost to ask questions, any questions about things you want to learn more about. I have benefitted hugely from some members here, even though I considered myself naive in the very beginning.

    With regards to your 'coping' mechanisms, for now avoidance is the best policy. Once you have more experience in life, then you can start to interact with women from a 'secure' position. By 'secure' I mean psychologically secure.

    But first, take things slowly, interact with this good forum and develop yourself bit by bit.
    A mother cannot raise a boy to be a man, not because he needs a father figure; but because she favours team vagina over her own son.

    Tradcon women are the most manipulative of all kinds of women, because they infect you with false hope.
    Radfems are your best friend, because they hate you and verbalise it - that's honesty!

    The red pill rage is a process which takes many many years - so be kind and patient with yourself.


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