• 5 Misconceptions about MGTOW

    Misconception #1. "MGTOWs are bitter that they’ve never had sex."

    Most men become MGTOWs after a marriage or a set of relationships. Which means they’ve had sex. But those men become MGTOW because they experience the hollow promise that are today’s relationships with women. Society (and women) sold the idea of a girlfriend or spouse as an asset but after nagging, histrionics, outlandish expectations, and ever-increasing entitlement, they found women to be more of a liability (despite the sex). If you visit the primary MGTOW forums: Happy Bachelor, Going Your Own Way, or MGTOWHQ, you’ll observe that most fall into this camp.

    Misconception #2. "Whatever their past life, once a man goes MGTOW, then he abstains."

    Generally, MGTOWs avoid one-itis LTRs that are a conveyor belt towards marriage and few MGTOWs get married AFTER taking the red pill. The sexual activity of MGTOWs, however, varies widely. On the main MGTOW forums, some have GFs, some date casually, some are into game, others are even married.

    A main observation of MGTOW is that women are overrated. They have always been overrated by society to encourage men to marry and pump out more workslaves. But now the delta between a woman’s actual value and perceived value has taken on comical proportions as female waistlines bulge and they adopt undesirable masculine qualities. This overvaluing of women happens amongst men as well; in that men will judge one another’s value on his ability to court women. It may have been more so in the past that a “quality” man was sought after by women, and so female interest had a true correlation with the actual value of a man. Feminist relaxing of social constraints on female mate selection criteria changes that. There are a lot of decent men on the sidelines and a lot of guys with questionable track records getting plenty of female attention.

    But either way, to be a “man” in yesteryear was to “win a woman over” for marriage and today it means gaming a chick into bed. Wheras in the past, being a “Real Man” meant marrying a woman (translation: the man is “good enough” for a woman), today the “Real Man” is measured by his ‘notch count’ and prioritizing the pursuit (translation: man is “good enough” for a woman). The more things change, the more they stay the same. In either case, a man’s value as judged by himself, his peers, and society at large is predicated on his ability to meet a woman’s requirements. MGTOW is calling bullshit on that.

    MGTOWs may date or not, but ultimately the importance of “success with women” is lower in their worldview.

    Misconception #3. "MGTOWs are not focused on self-betterment; they have given up."

    The key point here is that MGTOWs distinguish between Sexual Market Value (SMV) and Actual Value (AV). To define terms, Actual Value is having traits that make for a good person leading a meaningful life; actual ability, actual traits of good character. Let's start with the most basic- character: a fundamentally decent human being. Honest. Trustworthy. Strong. Resilient. Resourceful. These are traits of someone who is a good friend, a good worker, a good person all around to know. Then there are abilities- someone who is intelligent, has practical skills, a sense of humor. Finally, there are what he does- activities, interests, his job. SMV for us are male traits that women find attractive. Now naturally there may be some overlap between the two. But the general sentiment is that today, SMV and AV may be more misaligned than ever. Today, a guy like Kevin Federline is preferred to a guy with Actual Value. Whereas having a full sleeve tattoo may not put you in great position for the corner office, it can help your SMV. There are more examples, but decades ago, having an upstanding character and solid career prospects was more likely to garner female interest than in an era when women are largely in the workforce themselves and where feminism has unrestrained female hypergamy (which was always there) and leads women to unintentionally prioritize qualities in men that would have aided her survival in a pre-civilization era.

    MGTOWs separate themselves entirely from the paradigm that a man’s value is related to his ‘success’ with women. MGTOWs focus on life itself and discuss interests such as boxing, boating, lifting, surfing, cars, books, video games, real estate, as well as standard things men talk about like careers and travel. They see self-betterment in two dimensions: improving Actual Value, and enjoying life. Since some MGTOWs are interested in dating, there is talk of what one can do to improve SMV, but that is just part of the discussion.

    On “giving up”, many MGTOWs simply don’t find pursuit of women to be all that it’s hyped up to be. Some men don’t mind shit test after shit test and the standard fare of “maintaining” a woman today. Some do. Life is all about investment and return; and that influences how we spend our time. MGTOWs observe that given the nature of women and the trajectory we’re on, greater investment is needed for much lower return. And the cost of even maintaining an investment or portfolio comes at the expense of doing the things one enjoys. Thats why many MGTOWs who’ve come out of relationships aren’t champing at the bit to get back into one.

    Misconception #4. "MGTOWs are hermits who are basement-dwellers and shun all social interaction."

    “Ghosts” are a subset of MGTOWs who seek to minimize social interaction. But they are only a segment of MGTOW in general. Many MGOTWs are pursuing an active, social life (and have more time to do so).

    One reason people believe that MGTOWs avoid society is the “4 Levels of MGTOW” cited on MGTOW.com (and which is also cited on Red Pill’s 2014 direction). These levels include:

    Level 1: Situational awareness
    Level 2: Rejection of long-term relationships
    Level 3: Rejection of short-term relationships
    Level 4: Economic disengagement

    In reality, suffice to say, many MGTOWs don’t go onto Stage 3 (“Rejection of short-term relationships”), and even fewer go on to Stage 4 (“Economic disengagement”).

    There is no central mouthpiece of MGTOW and everyone is free to articulate their philosophies. My view is that MGTOWs lead full lives absent the pressure related to relationships or “success with women” which they see as an over-hyped social imposition. On the forums, you’ll encounter oil company executives, blue-collar workers, musicians -- a wide variety.

    Misconception #5. "MGTOWs are angry."

    Men enter into MGTOW awareness at different stages. Some do so right after divorce. Given the nature of family courts and their biases, who could blame those men for being angry afterwards? Like with other disappointments, people go through phases of dealing with this one- the false promise often encountered with LTRs and marriage. There is typically: surprise, anger, discontent (with society and double standards), acceptance and then enjoying a red-pill lifestyle absent the need to “man up” and find a soulmate/get married.

    Some say MGTOWs express this anger by “complaining” about women. I see it as explaining the nature of women. Because MGTOWs are not blinded by their need to court women, they can often be objective about female dynamics, faulty logic, and irrational nature. As Bill Burr says, “Women are constantly patting themselves on the back for how difficult their lives are and no one corrects them because they want to fuck ‘em.” [I]MGTOWs don’t have this problem and often can be effective on calling women on their BS rather than justify female behavior for any number of reasons.When a man is actively courting women, he is often forced to justify warped female behavior since critiquing it doesn’t aid in his pursuit. It is simpler to characterize it as justifiable behavior (ie: “women can’t be faulted for being women”) rather than acknowledge that certain female behavior has gotten worse, not due to biology but a more hospitable culture to female nonsense in general.

    Final thoughts:

    Red Pill is a starting point. From the Red Pill, based on our values and preferences, we can go in different directions. Blue pill society has rigged the game against men; and the red pill is about finding the right countermeasures to live life and enjoy it.

    The history of the manosphere has been that our sense of pride in validating our own life choice’s have often led us to cut down other men not following the same exact path. It explains the constant one-upmanship that’s taken place in the manosphere. We may not agree with each other’s approach, but hopefully we’ll acknowledge the validity of differing approaches (and the reality of overlap between the different approaches as opposed to their being discrete ‘movements’). To each, his own.

    Image source: Public Domain, for reuse
    Comments 10 Comments
    1. Cro-Magnon's Avatar
      Cro-Magnon -
      concise and to the point, a good introduction.
    1. orca's Avatar
      orca -
      I'm so glad I found this site, and when I read your text I can truly say that this is my experience as well. Unfortunatelly I took me so many years to realize it.
    1. DrunkenMaster's Avatar
      DrunkenMaster -
      Once again sir you have written an article which is easy to read and well structured .
    1. Chukhed's Avatar
      Chukhed -
      Great article. I've been in over a dozen sexual relationships in my life, so getting some is obviously not the problem {the most common misconception #1}.

      It's quite possible the men that condemn us for being MGTOW may actually be a little jealous of us for choosing freedom over the unhappy marriage shackles they were tricked into donning. Keep the bitch, i'm gonna go play xbox!
    1. Iron Me's Avatar
      Iron Me -
      Unfortunately I am one that fits the stereotype. I am in my late forties and have never had sex or even been romantically kissed by a girl. I am very physically unattractive and I look like I am mentally retarded, so no matter what i will never be a valuable male to any given normal woman. If any woman sees some sort of romantic value or value as a companion, they will be an even more bizarre woman in some way.

      But it's not really not having sex that bothers ne. What bothers me the most about this situation is never being wanted or respected. All women seem to do is loathe and fear me.

      And of course I feel the usual pressure of you have to have sex it's so great? If you don't then what's wrong with you? and the usual craptastic socially conditioned responses.

      You guys know what the definition of insanity is? Repeating something voer and over again expecting a different result.
    1. LastPriory's Avatar
      LastPriory -
      Excellent article. Let the haters taste piss.
    1. CDayT12A's Avatar
      CDayT12A -
      Great read! This would be a good read to help the man who is starting to see the cracks in the Blue Pill facade and could very easily lead to dialogue about MGTOW. Also the part about "having no central mouthpiece" and "everyone is free to articulate their own philosophies". To some men, myself included, just the ability to articulate our thoughts and emotions is extremely important, and too often stifled by the Blue Pill society.
    1. McGauth925's Avatar
      McGauth925 -
      "It's quite possible the men that condemn us for being MGTOW may actually be a little jealous of us for choosing freedom over the unhappy marriage."

      There IS a lot of misogyny in MGTOW. Having spent a little time reading hundreds of posts, I understand that better. Men have been duped. Most of us still are. What women and US society (can't speak for places I haven't lived, but UK and Australia are sounding very similar) want from men isn't good for men. Lots of men ARE pretty pissed off at women in general, and I have to say, that really does seem justified, to me. But, a short while ago, I was one of those who couldn't understand why so much animosity.

      BUT, women keep telling us the number one crime men commit against women is misogyny. So, I think much of the condemnation is for the rampant misogyny, and from men who haven't had their eyes opened. The feminist/female propaganda has been very successful. Lots of men buy it that women are wonderful, but oppressed, and men the evil oppressors.

      AND, as MGTOW grows, it looks more and more like a major revolution, which IS alarming to people who don't have much clue as to why it's necessary. Thus, MGTOWers sound like deranged extremists to people still in the matrix.

      AND, I agree with your speculation; misery loves company.
    1. Thomas Covenant's Avatar
      Thomas Covenant -
      Hi McGauth, if you want to post further you need to do us an introduction, the instructions are on top of this sub-forum;


      There IS a lot of misogyny in MGTOW.
      Not from me. They only get away with what society lets them.
    1. Lmaxvb's Avatar
      Lmaxvb -
      Here's my brief rejections of these misconceptions about MGTOW...

      Ever ask yourself why women/feminists define MGTOW as hating women?

      • Most/all those that claim that MGTOW as hatred of women are invariably against men (any man) being able to go their own way...

      But what do they mean? That we dont ever talk to women?

      • That's a bit hard to do if you're not a hermit living in a remote cave somewhere.. How will I buy my groceries if I dont talk to the checkout girl at the supermarket?

      That we dont ever have friends who are women?

      • Really? I've never had problems being friends with women at all...

      That we dont ever socialise with women?

      • Why shouldn't we? Why wouldn't we. That doesn't stop or preclude men from being MGTOW.

      That because we're going our own way, we hate women?

      • Here's something that may shock you. You dont actually have to hate women to be a MGTOW...

      I've found that all those that hate on MGTOW are simply projecting their own hate for men onto men. That's all.

      And the basis of being MGTOW:

      There's only one person you need to persuade when choosing to be a MGTOW, and that's yourself. Any opinions from other people on how you choose to live your life are irrelevant..

      No woman is as beautiful as the freedom of MGTOW.
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