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  1. #41

    Re: Can the West be saved?

    I don't think it will take 100 years, the current society is so unstable that a chance event, such as another Carrington Event, or a currency crisis may well collapse the government. Think it can't happen? Consider how the USSR collapsed over a weekend, it really can happen quickly.

  2. #42

    Re: Can the West be saved?

    I remember watching this special years ago about Osama bin Laden. When he was fighting in Afghanistan, he said that driving the Soviets out of Afghanistan would lead to the collapse of the Atheistic Soviet Union. He went on to say that the United States would be next, as it was a far more degnerate and morally weaker nation compared to the Soviet Union. Say what you will about the Soviet Union, they stomped out degeneracy. America bathes in it.
    "Traditionalism and Feminism are two sides of the same Gynocentric Coin".-Turd Flinging Monkey

  3. #43
    Senior Member MGTOWFOREVER's Avatar
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    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Quote Originally Posted by ABigSiameseCat View Post
    I don't think it will take 100 years, the current society is so unstable that a chance event, such as another Carrington Event, or a currency crisis may well collapse the government. Think it can't happen? Consider how the USSR collapsed over a weekend, it really can happen quickly.
    I just dont see the USA collapsing that fast. The collapse will take effect overtime. Technology will cause the death with society's acceptance of bullshit culture will be a close 2nd.

  4. #44
    Senior Member PistolPete's Avatar
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    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Sorry Otto "alt-right" is a moniker created by the left/socialists to demonize them. There is no such thing as "alt-right" except in the minds of the left. A more descriptive term would be the old "silent majority" from the Reagan era.

    Can Western Civilization be saved? No---so long as it is intent upon suicide. Just try stopping someone from killing themselves if they are really intent upon doing it...its impossible. Liberalism has been corroding Western Civilization since the days of Rousseau and Jeremy Bentham. However their goofy ideas were confined to academic arguments in the early days. Marx/Engels provided the conversion theology that transforms self destructive philosophy to a program of action.

    The only hope for western civilization is a categorical rejection of socialism in all its forms and an embrace of tradition, heritage, history and liberty. Embrace John Locke---not Jeremy Bentham. If we stand by and do nothing the Enlightenment will be a thing of the past.

  5. #45

    Re: Can the West be saved?

    @PistolPete
    I'm going to counter-signal you just a bit. I agree with you the term "Alt.-Right" is a term used to demonize those on the right by the left. There is a silent majority, and they are getting tired of the way things are going. They have seen jobs shipped overseas, destruction of the family, and mass immigration.

    Having said that, the Alt.-Right is very real. The modern Conservative Movement in the United States is a confederation that no longer is sustainable. Neo-Conservatives were Trotskyites that "discovered" Conservatism and began dominating the movement-always putting ethnic interests first. The hypocrisy is getting to a point that it can't be disguised any longer. Take the issue of Israel. In looking at the way Israel is run, it is akin to Apartheid South Africa. The same Neo-Conservatives will tell largely white GOP voters that they need to accept endless immigration and diversity. Yet, will defend the incredibly racist policies of the state of Israel. Israel does not allow mass non-Jewish Immigration. Most Jews are atheist/agnostic, so to argue that Israel is a theocratic state is false-it is an ethno-Nationalist state.

    We now live in a multiracial society. Hispanics, Blacks, Asians, and Jews fight in their own collective self-interests, whites are beginning to do the same. Conservatives (aka Cuckservatives) no longer have any answers but to double down on 'muh diversity. Remember when Karl Rove tried to sell the American public on "Hispanics are natural Conservatives"?
    "Traditionalism and Feminism are two sides of the same Gynocentric Coin".-Turd Flinging Monkey

  6. #46
    Senior Member MGTOWFOREVER's Avatar
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    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Quote Originally Posted by May 7 2020 View Post
    I thought we weren't supposed to talk politics in here.
    We are all adults here. The conversation is very civil and good. Don't think the mods would have a problem with it.

  7. #47
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    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Quote Originally Posted by MGTOWFOREVER View Post
    We are all adults here. The conversation is very civil and good. Don't think the mods would have a problem with it.
    There's a sticky says leave race and religion out of it. Didn't see anything about politics. Would probably be a good idea not to take it too far though.
    Every day I make the world a little bit worse.

  8. #48
    Senior Member PistolPete's Avatar
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    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Constitutional conservatives do have an answer: the Constitution and liberty. When you say confederation as applied to conservative I'm not sure what you mean. A confederation is an organization that consists of a number of parties or groups. I'm not sure what "groups" we're talking about. Neo-cons were not nor have they ever been conservative in the Constitutional sense of the word. So what groups are we to include in "conservative"? I shall eschew addressing the issue of Israel since it is irrelevant to the issue of our Constitution and the philosophy behind it. Besides I don't know all/most Jews so I cannot comment upon a sweeping statement that regarding their level of religiosity.

  9. #49

    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Couple of things. First, The Constitution of the United States is fairly shreaded. There is a term that is used that I have been warned on this forum not to use. It is also the last name of the character Mark Harmon plays on NCIS. The country is largely addicted to government spending/entitlements/programs and could care less about if these things are even Constitutional. IMHO here is who has made up the (broadly speaking) modern Conservative Movement in the US: Neo-Conservatives, Godless Capitalist types (libertarian/Ayn Rand worshippers), and Religious Right/Cultural Conservatives. At the end of the Bush II Presidency, you were starting to see this coalition unravel--as they really don't even like each other. Donald Trump was elected not just because of Barack Obama, but because of George W. Bush.

    I'm fairly certain you are well read on political matters. William F. Buckley was infamous for purging actual real Conservatives and members of the John Birch Society. Keep in mind that Mark Steyn, Joe Sobran, and Pat Buchanan were all purged from National Review. The magazine signed its death warrant back in April 2016 when it was promoting the idea of replacing President Andrew Jackson with Harriet Tubman on the $20 bill.
    "Traditionalism and Feminism are two sides of the same Gynocentric Coin".-Turd Flinging Monkey

  10. #50

    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Quote Originally Posted by May 7 2020 View Post
    I thought we weren't supposed to talk politics in here.
    The entire Canadian Federal Government is under the control of the nation's top mangina and is totally comprised of feminists. The country's second biggest mangina is Canada's Chief of Defense Staff who was appointed by the top mangina. How can we not talk about politics here???

    (I had recently queried one of the mods on the issue of politics. Having not received a response, I'm assuming that politics gets a green light unless we're told different).

  11. #51

    Re: Can the West be saved?

    @Autolite
    It has been suggested that Fidel Castro was the actual father of Justin Trudeau. I'm not necessarily a believer in that, but there is something strange. Apparently, Margret Trudeau's Official Schedule has several months in 1970-1971 that have not been made public. When governments keep secrets, this tends to make the public speculate.

    Obama looks like a "Top" compared to the bottom-boy Trudeau. I could see Justin Trudeau writing articles for The Good Men Project, total mangina.
    "Traditionalism and Feminism are two sides of the same Gynocentric Coin".-Turd Flinging Monkey

  12. #52

    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Quote Originally Posted by Otto Maddox View Post
    @Autolite
    It has been suggested that Fidel Castro was the actual father of Justin Trudeau. I'm not necessarily a believer in that, but there is something strange.
    It was well known that Margret Turdeau slept around a lot but Castro is not Justin's dad. The resemblance between Justin and his dad Pierre Turdeau is very strong. It will become even more apparent as Justin ages...

  13. #53
    Senior Member PistolPete's Avatar
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    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Actually I do not accept the premise that the Conservative--movement is made up of the groups you list. Neo-cons detest traditional conservatives. And social conservatives have little grasp of the nuances of constitutional philosophy. The narrative you made sounds a lot like material from a genders study course. Please do not confuse constitutionalism and the current government bureaucracy. Constitutionalists have been arguing for smaller government since the 40s. I also note you left off the TEA party. Noting that the congressional elections of 2012 2014 were driven by the TEA party I find its omission curious.

    Constitutional Conservatives strive for literal application of the Constitution. This is why the convention of the states under Article 5 of the Constitution has so much momentum. If conservatives were on the way out this wouldn't be the case. By last count I think we are three states short of what is needed and one of those states WOULD be on board but for 1 state senator who is blocking it. Further evidence is suggested by the fact that most state legislatures are now dominated by Republicans, and most of them are grass roots tea party conservatives.

  14. #54

    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Quote Originally Posted by Otto Maddox View Post
    @PistolPete
    I'm going to counter-signal you just a bit. I agree with you the term "Alt.-Right" is a term used to demonize those on the right by the left. There is a silent majority, and they are getting tired of the way things are going. They have seen jobs shipped overseas, destruction of the family, and mass immigration.

    Having said that, the Alt.-Right is very real. The modern Conservative Movement in the United States is a confederation that no longer is sustainable. Neo-Conservatives were Trotskyites that "discovered" Conservatism and began dominating the movement-always putting ethnic interests first. The hypocrisy is getting to a point that it can't be disguised any longer. Take the issue of Israel. In looking at the way Israel is run, it is akin to Apartheid South Africa. The same Neo-Conservatives will tell largely white GOP voters that they need to accept endless immigration and diversity. Yet, will defend the incredibly racist policies of the state of Israel. Israel does not allow mass non-Jewish Immigration. Most Jews are atheist/agnostic, so to argue that Israel is a theocratic state is false-it is an ethno-Nationalist state.

    We now live in a multiracial society. Hispanics, Blacks, Asians, and Jews fight in their own collective self-interests, whites are beginning to do the same. Conservatives (aka Cuckservatives) no longer have any answers but to double down on 'muh diversity. Remember when Karl Rove tried to sell the American public on "Hispanics are natural Conservatives"?
    You're completely off point here. Your description of the "conservative movement" is completely off. Where did you get your definition from?

  15. #55

    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Quote Originally Posted by Uly View Post
    The problem with trying to understand politics from a gender studies, is you are learning from essentially tabloid services, pandering to making women who accomplish nothing, to feel better about their lack of success in life. Women need to woman up and put the effort in to find success, but that is not found through a misinformation program that comes at the cost of the future of the person feeding into the lie.
    Yeah, but the women are victims line Otto is hustling is ever so popular. Just let poop bake in the sun for a day or two.

  16. #56

    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Quote Originally Posted by Otto Maddox View Post
    Couple of things. First, The Constitution of the United States is fairly shreaded. There is a term that is used that I have been warned on this forum not to use. It is also the last name of the character Mark Harmon plays on NCIS. The country is largely addicted to government spending/entitlements/programs and could care less about if these things are even Constitutional. IMHO here is who has made up the (broadly speaking) modern Conservative Movement in the US: Neo-Conservatives, Godless Capitalist types (libertarian/Ayn Rand worshippers), and Religious Right/Cultural Conservatives. At the end of the Bush II Presidency, you were starting to see this coalition unravel--as they really don't even like each other. Donald Trump was elected not just because of Barack Obama, but because of George W. Bush.

    I'm fairly certain you are well read on political matters. William F. Buckley was infamous for purging actual real Conservatives and members of the John Birch Society. Keep in mind that Mark Steyn, Joe Sobran, and Pat Buchanan were all purged from National Review. The magazine signed its death warrant back in April 2016 when it was promoting the idea of replacing President Andrew Jackson with Harriet Tubman on the $20 bill.
    You claim that Trump was elected due to the policies of previous administrations rather than the policies and (lack of) character of the politicians he was running against, both in the primary and general election. I don't see where you provided any evidence to support this assertion. What do you mean the Constitution is shredded? Yes, the Federal Government ignores large portions of it, but the Constitution also has meaning as a framework of how the government is supposed to be and certainly has relevance to the libertarians and Constitutional Conservatives.

  17. #57
    Senior Member ɹǝʍoʇ's Avatar
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    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Quote Originally Posted by PistolPete View Post
    Constitutional conservatives do have an answer: the Constitution and liberty. When you say confederation as applied to conservative I'm not sure what you mean. A confederation is an organization that consists of a number of parties or groups. I'm not sure what "groups" we're talking about. Neo-cons were not nor have they ever been conservative in the Constitutional sense of the word. So what groups are we to include in "conservative"? I shall eschew addressing the issue of Israel since it is irrelevant to the issue of our Constitution and the philosophy behind it. Besides I don't know all/most Jews so I cannot comment upon a sweeping statement that regarding their level of religiosity.
    Commonwealth of Massachusettts
    Preamble: The end of the institution, maintenance, and administration of government, is to secure the existence of the body politic, to protect it, and to furnish the individuals who compose it with the power of enjoying in safety and tranquility their natural rights, and the blessings of life: and whenever these great objects are not obtained, the people have a right to alter the government, and to take measures necessary for their safety, prosperity and happiness.

    I found all my answers in the "preamble" however, it's not the law and has no legal binding as are the constitutions. I fell between the cracks after a good hard shove from those that ignore both the law, court order, and the constitutions, continuing their march of tyranny that was started so long ago (1974). I'm executive, judicially, and legally intangible where I stand! The law fails on all fronts after it's allowed to be broken and treadled out of existence.

  18. #58
    Senior Member PistolPete's Avatar
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    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Tower as usual makes at least two great points. First the Declaration of Independence is not law per se, the Constitution is law. However his second point is more profound: To Wit is a law which obstructs fundamental liberty really a law at all? Take the Nuremberg statutes for example. those laws reduced Jews in Germany to second class citizens by stripping away individual liberties they had previously enjoyed. Now those laws were legally passed by a recognized and legitimate authority (the Riechstag) and duly signed into law in accordance with the accepted legal practice of the day---so is it law?

    Tower would agree with me that it is not. Because there is a higher law...a natural law which as the Declaration proudly declares endows men with basic rights which must be respected if a government is to be considered legitimate and its laws credible. Let us recall that it was Jeremy Bentham (Again) who was one of the principal advocates of the legal theory of positivism. This is a theory of jurisprudence that postulates that a law is valid if it is a command from a superior to an inferior and a failure to comply results in sanction. Thus all one needs is political authority and the means to punish in order for a law to be valid.

    NOW you can see why socialists embrace this philosophy. For a law to be a law you need only a command from the state---and bad things happening if you fail to obey. They reject the notion of natural law and the endowment of natural rights because this threatens their monopoly on power, and obliges the government to justify actions which infringe on individual rights.

    I didn't mean to high-jack the thread with a civics lesson but Tower's point(s) are very important and I just wanted to fill in the details.

  19. #59

    Re: Can the West be saved?

    Quote Originally Posted by PistolPete View Post
    Tower as usual makes at least two great points. First the Declaration of Independence is not law per se, the Constitution is law. However his second point is more profound: To Wit is a law which obstructs fundamental liberty really a law at all? Take the Nuremberg statutes for example. those laws reduced Jews in Germany to second class citizens by stripping away individual liberties they had previously enjoyed. Now those laws were legally passed by a recognized and legitimate authority (the Riechstag) and duly signed into law in accordance with the accepted legal practice of the day---so is it law?

    Tower would agree with me that it is not. Because there is a higher law...a natural law which as the Declaration proudly declares endows men with basic rights which must be respected if a government is to be considered legitimate and its laws credible. Let us recall that it was Jeremy Bentham (Again) who was one of the principal advocates of the legal theory of positivism. This is a theory of jurisprudence that postulates that a law is valid if it is a command from a superior to an inferior and a failure to comply results in sanction. Thus all one needs is political authority and the means to punish in order for a law to be valid.

    NOW you can see why socialists embrace this philosophy. For a law to be a law you need only a command from the state---and bad things happening if you fail to obey. They reject the notion of natural law and the endowment of natural rights because this threatens their monopoly on power, and obliges the government to justify actions which infringe on individual rights.

    I didn't mean to high-jack the thread with a civics lesson but Tower's point(s) are very important and I just wanted to fill in the details.

    Socialists/ leftists/ Marxists/ feminists hate it when all of the facts are know. Truth kills their narrative.

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    Re: Can the West be saved?

    There seems to be some confusion about what saving the west even means. In my opinion, itīs not that hard. People need to re-connect with their land and change the way they spend money. If you spend your life between the office and a city apartment, interrupted by the occasional trip to exotic places, how are you supposed to know what itīs all worth?
    Every time you buy some cheap china import, you cast a vote. Eat local, seasonal food, support small businesses and livelihoods. Insist on quality and pay fair prices. Take care of the environment at home, plant a tree, clean up your neighbourhood. Take the kids out to visit a farm. Experiences over materialism. Save money. Instead of spending hours in an artificial gym, go out and actually do something for the community.
    We have today the best conditions ever in history to live a long life, have a family and see our grandkids. But you have to start building early, keep it together and find a partner who builds with you. Itīs not easy but I see more and more people taking responsibility for things they did not cause - such as plastic pollution in the oceans and the whole environmental mess.


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